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Dale Williams

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Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Dale Williams » Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:00 pm

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-1 ... trial.html

Here's a good article from Mike Steinberger (before the punitive damages were awarded, but with a link to transcript of closing arguments)
http://winediarist.com/the-wine-trials-an-update/
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David M. Bueker

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by David M. Bueker » Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:29 pm

And so the dominoes begin to fall.
There behind the glass lies a real blade of grass. Be careful as you pass. Move along. Move along.
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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Mark Lipton » Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:32 pm

I am confused why people still refer to him as Rudy Kurniawan and as Indonesian. Wasn't it established that he's actually Chinese and named Zhen Wang Huang? As hard as I try, I can only muster so much sympathy for Bill Koch, but I still view this decision as an important one.

Mark Lipton
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Robin Garr

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Robin Garr » Fri Apr 12, 2013 5:53 pm

Mark Lipton wrote:I am confused why people still refer to him as Rudy Kurniawan and as Indonesian. Wasn't it established that he's actually Chinese and named Zhen Wang Huang?

Because he established a significant identity as Kurniawan, and to drop that identity would be, in essence, to let him escape public shaming?
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Kelly Young

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Kelly Young » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:48 pm

I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?
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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Robin Garr » Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:44 pm

Kelly Young wrote:I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?

Post it on the forum? Or on Facebook? :lol:
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Brian Gilp

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Brian Gilp » Sat Apr 13, 2013 9:16 am

Kelly Young wrote:I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?


Ah......Red Bicyclette I assume.

Read more at http://www.decanter.com/news/wine-news/ ... kYybCZr.99
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Paul Winalski

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Paul Winalski » Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:46 pm

I think criminal fraud charges, and jail time, are in order here.

-Paul W.
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Dale Williams

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Dale Williams » Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:24 pm

Mark Lipton wrote:I am confused why people still refer to him as Rudy Kurniawan and as Indonesian. Wasn't it established that he's actually Chinese and named Zhen Wang Huang? As hard as I try, I can only muster so much sympathy for Bill Koch, but I still view this decision as an important one.


Koch's lawsuit against Rudy said that was his real name, but did it say he was actually a Chinese citizen? Suharto prosecuted ethnic Chinese Indonesians and required them to acquire "Indonesian" names. So lots of Chinese Indonesians have 2 names. In any case suits usually use the name that the person used at the time. People sue John Wayne, Mark Twain, Albert Brooks (real name Albert Einstein!), Marilyn Monrie, Balthus, etc. I have no knowledge one way or the other, but his name is probably the least incriminating thing.

While its hard to feel sorry for either side in a battle of the billionaires (well, at least onetime billionaire in Greenberg's case), EG came across as a super a#%hole. I'll tip my hat to Koch for his doggedness, it's ultimately a plus for the wine world. And hey, at least he's better than his brothers! :)

What I'm trying to figure out is if I met Rudy K briefly. in 2005 I was at a big goodbye dinner for a friend moving to UK to study for his MW. About 2 dozen people at Bayard. There was a young Asian guy surrounded by young Acker-olytes. Someone referred to him as "doctor" (at the time, I thought maybe he was a doctor). He blinded group with a mag of Burgundy (nothing superspecial, something like a 1987 Rene Engel). In retrospect figured it must have been Rudy. If so, this was about point where he went from a huge buyer to a huge seller. Maybe he was auditioning the Engel to see if it was a good candidate for being becoming a 78 or 85 DRC. :)
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Victorwine

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Victorwine » Mon Apr 15, 2013 10:55 am

Not really related, but interesting. Just read this article in the New York Post-
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/that ... cVonpeqhyJ

Salute
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Lou Kessler

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Lou Kessler » Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:36 pm

Kelly Young wrote:I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?

I know a guy who is an expert on that type of wine, he also sold me some shares in the Brooklyn bridge at a great price. Want his ph. #?
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Kelly Young

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Kelly Young » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:28 am

Lou Kessler wrote:
Kelly Young wrote:I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?

I know a guy who is an expert on that type of wine, he also sold me some shares in the Brooklyn bridge at a great price. Want his ph. #?


Sorry man, I beat you to the punch. Just purchased the Bridge for $3,000.00. Going to celebrate with the $70.00 bottle of Petrus he sold me.
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Lou Kessler

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Re: Koch decks Greenberg- $12 million in punitive

by Lou Kessler » Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:38 pm

Kelly Young wrote:
Lou Kessler wrote:
Kelly Young wrote:I'm really worried about the authenticity of the $10.99 bottle of Languedoc red I just bought. Who should I turn to?

I know a guy who is an expert on that type of wine, he also sold me some shares in the Brooklyn bridge at a great price. Want his ph. #?


Sorry man, I beat you to the punch. Just purchased the Bridge for $3,000.00. Going to celebrate with the $70.00 bottle of Petrus he sold me.


Damn! Crime doesn't pay, not like it used to!

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