WTN: 1998 CdP progress

When the 98 Roger Sabon Reservee was released, I really liked the wine and purchased a case. I've consumed a bottle here and there, with six bottles left in the cellar. I opened one tonight and was disappointed. I hope it is just an off bottle, but this bottle has taken on a distinct pruney character that I do not care for at all. Balance, acidity and tannins are fine, but the prunes are a no go. You might want to check a bottle if you have any cellared away.

Randy, I tasted this two years ago, and disliked it -- the same pruney flavor -- I wrote "unpleasant dried fruit tastes" -- you found. I gave it 1* but didn't write anything else.

There are a couple of notes that are mixed on Cellar Tracker -- earlier notes are generally negative, although a couple are positive.

1998 Roger Sabon Châteauneuf-du-Pape Cuvée Prestige (France, Rhône, Southern Rhône, Châteauneuf-du-Pape)

5/17/2007 Ski695 92

First one tasted in maybe 5 years. Nose was somewhat muted. palate was much better, smooth, dark fruited and very drinkable. That may not sound like high praise but it is from me. Barely any secondary notes at this point. (68 views)

8/20/2006 Venice Al 88

Somewhat disappointing as I recall purchasing based on "fabulous" recommendations. Opened with a tart piercing nose. Settled down to reveal rasberry and other red fruit, and some forest floor. Tart-acidic character leaves me to believe this wine is slightly out of balance. Not a bad wine - I would definitely decant- but certainly not oustanding. Dinner on the other hand - at Wilson's (Michael Wilson- formerly of 5 Dudley) was an informal dining treat. (411 views)

Regards, Bob

That doesn't bode well for my remaining bottles, Bob. I'll serve them to Jenise when she is visiting -- she'll never know the difference after a few shots of Padron tequila...

Isn't the overripe sugary character a classic note of the 98 CdPs?

Not that all should be similarly advanced however. The 98 Mont Olivet I had last month was not necessarily "pruney" - although it did have plenty of rich raisins

[David M. Bueker]

Isn't the overripe sugary character a classic note of the 98 CdPs?

No. Some did handle the vintage better than others. Wines like Vieux Donjon, Clos des Papes, Olivet (a personal favorite), Vieux Telegraphe, etc. are rich, but also structured CNdPs that do not go past the point of ripeness into overripe.

Now if we're talking newer styled producers or the luxury cuvees then it's a whole 'nother ballgame, but then I've never tried to think of the luxury cuvees (exception: Beaucastel's Hommage) as actual CNdP, but as another type of wine.

Now if we're talking newer styled producers or the luxury cuvees then it's a whole 'nother ballgame, but then I've never tried to think of the luxury cuvees (exception: Beaucastel's Hommage) as actual CNdP, but as another type of wine.

I hear you, David. Let's see: make a wine that showcases surmaturité, expose it to unheard-of amounts of new oak, then charge 5X times the normal price? Back up the trucks™!!!!

Mark Lipton

I've detected a prune note over the last 1-1.5 yrs. It has me worried.

Isn't the overripe sugary character a classic note of the 98 CdPs?

Not that all should be similarly advanced however. The 98 Mont Olivet I had last month was not necessarily "pruney" - although it did have plenty of rich raisins :wink:

I consider the '98s, generally speaking, to have more roasted fruit qualities (usually immature phenolic ripeness). This results in a pruney quality, something I have noted in several recent wines (Les Cailloux, Marcoux, P. Usegglio, Jaboulet (Cedres) and others). I think of overripeness to show more of a raisin quality (i.e. too much hang time). Good bottles of Vieux Donjon are stunning. In the last year I've had VT, Pegau Resv, Beaucastel, Vieille Julienne (nondesignate) and Janasse Chaupin...all showed copious CdP fruit qualities, but will require several yrs of further cellaring...at least 3-5, imho.

Still have R.Usseglio, Vieille Julienne VV and Bosquet des Papes Chantemerle to try.

Greg, while the Les Cailloux I just had the other day was ripe, it was no where near as pruney as the Roger Sabon for my palate. The Les Cailloux needs drinking though.

Thanks for the update on the Donjon and VT which are still gathering dust in my cellar -- sounds like no rush.

Reading some notes on Cellartracker on 98 Beaucastel and it appears it was a better year in the North.

[David M. Bueker]

David - in the Northern Rhone? Kind of a tannic, middling year there. The stunner year for hte north was '99.

'98 was a fantastic year for CNdP, but the wines are ripe. '99 was a more classic year in the south. I have noticed that a number of the poorer notes on CellarTracker are from folks who bought bottles well after release. Provenance issues? Perhaps.

And of course it's always wise to take CT notes with a grain of salt - even mine!

David

You are probably right. I have not opened cdp from either of those years yet. I did open a horific bottle of 1999 Domaine les Pallieres Gigondas on the weekend but I think it was off or corked. It is interesting reading the Cellartracker notes though. :*)

David - in the Northern Rhone? Kind of a tannic, middling year there. The stunner year for hte north was '99.

'98 was a fantastic year for CNdP, but the wines are ripe. '99 was a more classic year in the south. I have noticed that a number of the poorer notes on CellarTracker are from folks who bought bottles well after release. Provenance issues? Perhaps.

And of course it's always wise to take CT notes with a grain of salt - even mine!

David,
Keep in mind that it used to common practice (and still persists to this day) of producers in the Rhone Vly to bottle their wines over a fairly lengthy period of months/years, so that a later-bottled wine might have quite a different character to one of the earlier-bottled examples, usually showing as less fruity/more oxidized. Even fairly recently, I recall Clos du Mont-Olivet doing this, but how common it is now I have no idea. And, like you, I take all CT notes with many grains of salt unless I know the person writing them.

Mark Lipton

[David M. Bueker]

Multiple bottlings are less common than they used to be, but still happen at a few estates. (I don't think Beaucastel is one though.)