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Rahsaan

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Rahsaan » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:16 pm

Timo Olavi wrote:Also, I can not agree that they are more sour or more extreme as of late, considering that artisanal Lambic beers have been around for at least two hundred years, and since sour beers routinely rely on the metabolites of micro-organisms (rather than the the malt bill or hops) for their character, lower acidity would more often than not just lead to bland results.


I don't know if sour beers are more sour as of late. But in the US, it was an almost-unheard of category a few years ago and it has very quickly spread to all the craft breweries. (Which these days is pretty widespread)

And when that happens, not everyone does a very good job of things!
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Mike Filigenzi

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Mike Filigenzi » Thu Jan 11, 2018 10:50 pm

Sours have definitely become popular at craft breweries around here and probably qualify as the latest trend. They're still finding their footing around here and as Rahsaan said, some are much better than others. I think they're a harder sell than the IPAs, though. It will be interesting to see whether that trend is as enduring as the IPA trend or not.
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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Sat Jan 13, 2018 2:34 pm

Food served in large bowls so you need to use a knife at a steep angle. Only point I can see is so the wait staff don't have to take care bring it to you from the kitchen.
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Barb Downunder

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Barb Downunder » Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:42 am

Peter May wrote:Food served in large bowls so you need to use a knife at a steep angle. Only point I can see is so the wait staff don't have to take care bring it to you from the kitchen.


And what is also annoying you can’t rest your cutlery on the rim of your plates they fall in.!

I have also recently come across a trend o “bowls “ eg taco bowl, burger bowl and I cannot think what else. Just a ginormous and unnecessary IMHO deconstruction of a dish with the added irritation of the deep bowl yndrome you mention.
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Mike Filigenzi

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Mike Filigenzi » Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:16 pm

Just as a data point on the beer thing out here, I was one of the more prominent craft breweries in our town with a friend last Saturday. There were 14 beers on the menu, and seven of them were IPAs. Maybe it's just because I'm not an IPA guy, but that seems ridiculous to me.

Agree completely on the "bowl" thing. That's just lazy.
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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:01 pm

Burgers served in brioche buns.

Brioche is too soft, too porous, not firm enough to support the weight of a burger, and turns to gloop in your hands as it absorbs to meat juices.

Putting a burger in brioche doesn't make it 'gourmet', it makes it difficult to eat.
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Peter May

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For You!

by Peter May » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:05 pm

Wait staff adding 'for you' at the end of queries.

Can I clear this plate for you?

No, it's not for me. I wasn't going to do it anyway, and if I'd urgently needed the plate cleared I'd have asked.
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Jenise

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Jenise » Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:15 pm

Peter May wrote:Burgers served in brioche buns.

Brioche is too soft, too porous, not firm enough to support the weight of a burger, and turns to gloop in your hands as it absorbs to meat juices.

Putting a burger in brioche doesn't make it 'gourmet', it makes it difficult to eat.


Couldn't agree with you more!!!!

And they're SWEET! All wrong.
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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Sun Feb 04, 2018 7:57 am

Jenise wrote:
Peter May wrote:Burgers served in brioche buns.

]


And they're SWEET! All wrong.


But aren't standard hamburger 'buns' for example as used by McDonald's sweet?

I assumed it was because they were sweet they were called buns rather than rolls.

(In British English buns are sweetened and rolls are not)
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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Mike Filigenzi » Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:20 pm

Peter May wrote:
Jenise wrote:
Peter May wrote:Burgers served in brioche buns.

]


And they're SWEET! All wrong.


But aren't standard hamburger 'buns' for example as used by McDonald's sweet?

I assumed it was because they were sweet they were called buns rather than rolls.

(In British English buns are sweetened and rolls are not)


I've always used the term "hamburger bun" as more descriptive of the shape of it rather than the taste. So a hamburger bun is a round bun that is thick enough to slice in half for hamburger use. They can be a little sweet or they can be done with sourdough or whole wheat. Might have onions or poppy seeds involved. No matter what it's made out of, I'll call it a hamburger bun and not a hamburger roll. I've always used "bun" similarly for hot dog buns. I tend to associate "roll" with dinner rolls, which are often a bit sweet. This isn't really consistent, though, as a Kaiser roll is more or less a variant of a hamburger bun. This may all be a regional thing, of course. I don't know if the same rules hold in other parts of the U.S.
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Jeff Grossman

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Jeff Grossman » Mon Feb 05, 2018 2:15 am

Here, too. I think "bun" refers to shape more than to taste or texture. Although, buns do tend to have a texture with smaller holes.
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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Mon Feb 05, 2018 6:54 am

I've spent an interesting time looking at the etymology behind various buns and rolls, including kaiser (gosh!), hoagies(I never knew what that meant) and subs (I guessed it was from their submarine shape, and etc.

From Wikipedia

A bun is normally made from dough that has been enriched with sugar and butter and sometimes egg. Without any of these the dough remains to be 'bread dough' rather than 'bun dough' and the resultant product will be called a roll, rather than a bun.

and also

Hamburger bun – typically round buns designed to encase a hamburger; invented in 1916 by a fry cook named Walter Anderson, who co-founded White Castle in 1921

which led to the fascinating story of White Castle and how they not only popularised hamburgers but also invented the production line techniques of fast food, which I'd thought was the legacy of McDonalds. And invented and manufactured the paper hats!

Interesting they are still a private company and own all their outlets, no franchises. Which may be the reason they are not spread as wide at McD's.

I've never been in a White Castle or had any of products, but I'm tempted now.
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Robin Garr

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Robin Garr » Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:21 am

This post from a blog called alansmysteriousworld.wordpress.com rises to the top of Google's hits when one asks "difference between bun and roll." :) I think its finding that (in the U.S., at least), "The US Food and Drug Administration ... draws no distinction between buns and rolls" may be the most significant finding.

What’s the Difference Between a Bun and a Roll?
September 17, 2010

The US Food and Drug Administration stipulates only that breads weigh more than one-half pound per unit and that rolls and buns weigh less than one-half pound. All three starches must be yeast-leavened bakery product. But the FDA draws no distinction between buns and rolls. And neither do retail bakeries. One company’s “hamburger buns” is another’s “hamburger rolls.”

Tom Lehmann, a trusty source at the American Institute of Baking, while conceding that there is no clear-cut answer, passed along a short write-up that the Institute prepared: “The term ‘roll’ is generally applied to filled products, especially those that are formed by sheeting and rolling-up or folding the dough, such as cinnamon rolls (which, in many areas, are sold as cinnamon buns) and Danish rolls. There are exceptions to this, however, in that hard-crusted products are also included in the roll category. Products of this type include Kaiser-rolls and French rolls. Buns, on the other hand, are generally more bread-like in shape (round or elongated) and typically do not contain a filling. The one notable exception to this is the Easter favorite, hot-cross buns.”

Simon Jackel, director of Plymouth Technical Services, concurs with the Institute, but argues that it might be more accurate to contrast them by indicating that buns are usually soft, and that rolls can be hard or soft. But ultimately, Jackel muses that pinpointing the answer to this question is “sort of like asking: ‘Is it a hamburger or a chopped-beef patty?’”

(Submitted by Robert Lawler of Ivyland, Pennsylvania)
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Paul Winalski

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Paul Winalski » Mon Feb 05, 2018 5:55 pm

Regarding White Castle: indeed they are one of the first, if not THE first, chain restaurants. They operate in the Midwest and Mid Atlantic region of the USA. We don't have them here in New England. Their signature small, square hamburger is grilled with chopped onions and with the hamburger bun on top, so that the bun gets steamed. The result is the hamburger that you always see Wimpy eating in the Popeye cartoons. Among the nicknames for them are "sliders" and "belly bombs". Americans seem to either adore them or hate them. I'm decidedly in the latter camp, but I have friends who grew up in New York and view them as comfort food.

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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Wed Feb 07, 2018 5:17 am

Robin Garr wrote:This post from a blog called alansmysteriousworld.wordpress.com rises to the top of Google's hits when one asks "difference between bun and roll." :) I think its finding that (in the U.S., at least), "The US Food and Drug Administration ... draws no distinction between buns and rolls" may be the most significant finding.


As far as I can see the USDA here are not trying to define what a roll or bun is made from, other than it is yeast-leavened, they are only using weight to say it it weighs less than half-a-pound its not bread (presumably that defined as a loaf) but its a bun or roll.

I don't understand the need for that definition, presumably something to do with taxes or some sort of regulation.

UK had an ancient law, going back centuries, that a loaf must be a minimum weight. That piece of consumer protection was binned by the meddling EU.
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Bill Spohn

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Bill Spohn » Fri Feb 16, 2018 2:03 pm

On the original question, I agree that when you get more than one prep of an ingredient there is always a favourite and a loser - in fact the more variations the more losers. It's like you have only 10 points to award any dish and with variations they have to be shared among them.

Only exception I can think of is foie gras. I can take more than one form and enjoy all - a torchon, a terrine, etc. But then I am a bit daft about FG.

BTW, I agree that wooden trenchers are a health nightmare and an affectation that should have no place in good food service which should have no need of such gimmicks.
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Howie Hart

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Howie Hart » Sat Feb 17, 2018 7:49 am

I don't know if it needs to die or not, but whenever I see a fried (or poached) egg on top of something like a burger I want to gag.
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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Jenise » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:33 pm

Peter May wrote:
But aren't standard hamburger 'buns' for example as used by McDonald's sweet?

I assumed it was because they were sweet they were called buns rather than rolls.


No, neither standard (grocery store) nor McDonald's buns are sweet. It's just standard in America to call the bread item that is going to receive a filling, be it hamburger patty, wiener, sloppy joe, what have you, a bun. If it is baked for the dinner table and to be a recipient of butter, then it's a roll. But of course there are exceptions. As someone else pointed out, the Kaiser is called a roll, not a bun. No idea why!
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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Jenise » Tue Feb 20, 2018 4:35 pm

Howie Hart wrote:I don't know if it needs to die or not, but whenever I see a fried (or poached) egg on top of something like a burger I want to gag.


Putting fried eggs on food is definitely a major trend. And I feel like you about it.
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Robin Garr

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Robin Garr » Tue Feb 20, 2018 5:01 pm

Jenise wrote:No, neither standard (grocery store) nor McDonald's buns are sweet.

Well, not so fast ... no, McDonald's buns aren't sweet like pastries or sticky buns, but Mickey D's puts a little taste of sugar in almost everything they make, presumably because 21st century Americans are essentially addicted to sugar and crave it.

McDonald's admits it:
https://yourquestions.mcdonalds.ca/answ ... -in-a-bun/

Lots of sources, not all of them as lefty as Mother Jones here, decry it:
https://www.motherjones.com/environment ... y-cookies/
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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by RichardAtkinson » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:34 pm

Burgers that are too big to eat. What is wrong with people? A good burger is a "balance" of meat, bread & fixins.
You should be able to comfortably hold it & not un-hinge your jaw just to take a bite. Or have to revert to Fork / knife.

More is not always better.
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Bill Spohn

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Bill Spohn » Tue Feb 20, 2018 7:48 pm

Agree with the burger - I usually take out the stuff that slides around (tomato, avocado) and the stuff that just adds to thickness without much flavour. If it is still too big to get a bite of, it isn't a burger made for eating like a burger, it is made for having visual impact and that only sometimes goes with flavour.
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Peter May

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Peter May » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:54 am

I found McDonalds hamburger buns to be quite sweet. I didn't find consider them as ordinary bread, unlike Kaiser rolls, which to me were ordinary bread.

Maybe that's because my palate wasn't used to the sweetness in some American foods. I found butter also sweet.

Jenise, sorry for delay in reply, internet access here has been down more than up
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Jenise

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Re: Let's discuss trends that need to die

by Jenise » Wed Feb 21, 2018 3:31 pm

Robin Garr wrote:
Jenise wrote:No, neither standard (grocery store) nor McDonald's buns are sweet.

Well, not so fast ... no, McDonald's buns aren't sweet like pastries or sticky buns, but Mickey D's puts a little taste of sugar in almost everything they make


Oh I get that. And as someone who neither eats nor drinks sweet stuff, I detect it quite easily and when others don't. Sugar is also in all the pre-made food at Costco and Trader Joe's, too. But all the same, to my tastes McDonald's buns aren't sweet--it's more like the way fruit shows in a very dry wine. Unlike the overtly sweet buns that are now the norm at Hardee's/Carls Jr. Used to quite like Carls Jr but probably hadn't experienced one in close to 20 years when, on our last road trip into the midwest on a day when we had to pound at least 600 miles, we needed to eat quickly and went to a Hardee's. The bun tasted like pastry. Gross! File that under 'Never Again'.
My wine shopping and I have never had a problem. Just a perpetual race between the bankruptcy court and Hell.--Rogov
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