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Tim York

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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Tim York » Tue Mar 11, 2014 3:37 pm

Côtes du Rhône Terre des Aigles 2012 - Domaine Richaud - Alc.15% - (c.€10), made from Grenache 60%, Syrah 17%, Carignan 13%, Mourvèdre 6%, Counoise 4%. This estate is usually classed amongst those farming organically but there are no claims about it on the label.

Marcel Richaud is a magician. This lowly CdR has an elegance of shape, aroma and fruit which is not common in the region together with a lovely silky texture. Its pure notes of sweet cherry with dabs of kirsch make me think of the grandiose Ch.Rayas and at a more affordable level some of the wines from Domaine Gramenon further to the north where the climate is less warm than around Cairanne. Body is medium + with adequate firmness of the finish but no sense of burn which the 15% alcohol would lead me to expect. Very good indeed and QPR!!

Now I'm living in France, this is one of the estates from which I can mail order in confidence.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Joy Lindholm » Tue Mar 11, 2014 5:07 pm

David M. Bueker wrote:I struggle with the idea of on-line ordering of a $15 wine.


Where have you found this online for $15? My online search shows anything from $19.99 up to $25.99 (at Chambers St. for the 2012).
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:47 pm

The '08 cost me $15. Last time I saw it.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by JC (NC) » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:45 am

2011 Legaris Verdejo Rueda, Spain. 13% abv. Retails for about $15. Screwcap. A slightly greenish tint to the pale gold liquid with transparency. Pungent nose. Pear and gooseberry on both the nose and palate. The gooseberry is suggestive of Sauvignon Blanc from New Zealand. I thought it showed best partway between chilled from the refrigerator and warmed to room temperature. I paired it with boiled, mildly seasoned shrimp and a tossed salad and the pairing worked admirably. Another option for white wine from Spain although in most cases I would probably prefer an Albarino. Next up a Barbera.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:18 am

Nice to see a Verdejo note here, have posted a few in my time :D .

2009 Paternina Rioja Crianza.

Reports suggest that a new regime at Paternina are turning things around after a dismal past few yrs. I was quite surprised with this one so forumites should look around. I paid $22 Cdn and enjoyed with veal cutlet and mushroom sauce.
Light color, old world aromatics on the nose, earth spice some tobacco.
Smooth, soft, some sweet tobacco, nice aftertaste. Dried herbs, cherry, blackberry. Held up very well over three days.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Tim York » Wed Mar 12, 2014 8:30 am

Bob Parsons Alberta wrote:Nice to see a Verdejo note here, have posted a few in my time :D .

2009 Paternina Rioja Crianza.

Reports suggest that a new regime at Paternina are turning things around after a dismal past few yrs. I was quite surprised with this one so forumites should look around. I paid $22 Cdn and enjoyed with veal cutlet and mushroom sauce.
Light color, old world aromatics on the nose, earth spice some tobacco.
Smooth, soft, some sweet tobacco, nice aftertaste. Dried herbs, cherry, blackberry. Held up very well over three days.


The last time I had a Paternina (I think it was Banda Azul) I found it horribly oaky and I vowed "never again". It sounds as if I should take another look, but fat chance of finding many Spanish wines here!
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:27 pm

This was the Azul Tim, should have mentioned that.
How are the visits to the local market? I would be really intrigued to see what is on the shelves at the local wine stores there in Normandy.
Nice CdR note from you earlier.
Hope horses have settled in OK
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Howie Hart » Thu Mar 13, 2014 12:34 am

Hart Wine Cellar 2012 Vidal Blanc – semi-dry
Disclaimer – I don't generally like to post WTNs on my own wines, but just for a little fun, and since we're talking inexpensive wins this month, I thought I'd post about this wine as my entry for the cheapest wine. I've been buying these grapes (and Cayuga) from a grower about 5 miles from my home. He sells them to me for $5 per picking box, which translates to 50 cents per bottle for juice. A cork costs about 20 cents; a label less than 5 cents and if I give it away, I add a capsule, that costs about 12 cents. I recycle bottles, so I don't count that. Therefor, the wine is less than $1.00.
The wine is 80% Vidal and 20% Cayuga; 1.5% RS; 11.5% abv. Medium straw color. Nose of honeydew melon, grapefruit, and a touch of pineapple. Good acid balance and medium-long, full finish.
Note – I like to promote home wine making. I believe it enhances one's appreciation of wine.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Tim York » Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:36 am

Bob Parsons Alberta wrote:I would be really intrigued to see what is on the shelves at the local wine stores there in Normandy.

Hope horses have settled in OK


It's early days, Bob, for me to give a report on wine stores, though it is quite relevant to this thread as there is a lot of interesting availability at less than €15 and even €10.

In France, people buy wines in five ways;

- from the supermarket (I guess about 80+% of sales, but the least interesting choice except at the autumn Foires aux Vins)
- directly from the grower, either by mail order or visit
- on the internet (several well stocked sites)
- from a caviste (small independents in town/village centres)
- from a chain, of which the most famous is Nicolas found in many places and worth exploring if nothing better readily available.

By far the most interesting choice comes from cavistes, who are usually enthusiasts with contacts in the vineyards and having special areas of interest. However, prices seem quite high there; some 20% higher than I would expect to pay at a Belgian caviste and 30-40% higher than at the cellar door.

The best nearby which I have so far located is in the centre of Lisieux and offers one or two foreign wines which didn't stimulate my interest. The French range, though, is quite adventurous. After a lot of Bordeaux and Burgundy, the South West gets some good shelf space with several from Fronton, some Marcillac, Cahors and Gaillac. There are also good ranges of appellations from Languedoc/Roussillon, Rhône, Savoie (including Bugey) and an interesting line in older vinatges from Chinon, Bourgueil and Saumur-Champigny but at distinctly high prices (well over 15€ so not for this thread). An interesting feature is that the estates are nearly all previously unknown to me, so we are relying on the caviste's skills as a wine picker. So far I have opened two or three from him, as well as the Fronton on which I wrote a TN, and they have been good, particularly a Faugères and a Bugey (but no TNs because in-house PO threw away the empties so quickly that I did not note the details :? ).

As one would expect, there is a fine caviste stocking estates better known to me in rich Deauville; I visited him a few years ago and certainly do so again in the near future. At Trouville across the river mouth, there is a famous caviste but looking through his window I was horrified by the prices (over 300€ for a certain vintage of Ch.Rayas, at least 100€ more than the highest quote in Wine Searcher!).

The horses have just arrived and are in outside stables until accommodation and fences for them are installed at home. Son-in-law Patrick is busy helping us with that. The dogs love it and spend all day digging up nests of field mice and hopefully nothing nastier.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:00 am

Howie Hart wrote:Hart Wine Cellar 2012 Vidal Blanc – semi-dry
Disclaimer – I don't generally like to post WTNs on my own wines, but just for a little fun, and since we're talking inexpensive wins this month, I thought I'd post about this wine as my entry for the cheapest wine. I've been buying these grapes (and Cayuga) from a grower about 5 miles from my home. He sells them to me for $5 per picking box, which translates to 50 cents per bottle for juice. A cork costs about 20 cents; a label less than 5 cents and if I give it away, I add a capsule, that costs about 12 cents. I recycle bottles, so I don't count that. Therefor, the wine is less than $1.00.
The wine is 80% Vidal and 20% Cayuga; 1.5% RS; 11.5% abv. Medium straw color. Nose of honeydew melon, grapefruit, and a touch of pineapple. Good acid balance and medium-long, full finish.
Note – I like to promote home wine making. I believe it enhances one's appreciation of wine.


Yeah, but the love and hard work you put into it...priceless!
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:05 am

2009 Louis Jadot Moulin-à-Vent Château des Jacques - France, Burgundy, Beaujolais, Moulin-à-Vent (3/13/2014)
Last time I had this (2/2011) I said I would wait 5 years to have it again. Well after 2 years I broke down, and it was a mistake. This is still dark and now it is into a brooding phase. There's still great depth, so I will try and restrain myself for the other three years before I open my other bottles.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by JC (NC) » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:14 am

David, is this the Clos des Rochegres des Jacques? If so, I purchased two bottles but have already consumed one.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by JC (NC) » Sat Mar 15, 2014 1:25 am

2010 AZIENDA AGRICOLA L"ARMANGIA BARBERA D'ASTI SOPRA BERRUTI, Piedmont, Italy. 14% abv. I paid $18.99 at a local wine shop but some places it is available for $15.99. Darkly colored and opaque in the glass with viscosity. Flavor of raspberries and dark cherries but initially with an aftertaste I don't really like--a bit too rustic. I decided it needed complementary food such as lasagne or meat ravioli. Since I went out of town the day after opening it, it remained open over four evenings (recorked and refrigerated in between glasses.) The unpleasant aftertaste disappeared by the third evening and I was reminded of why I had liked this wine in the first place. Recommended with reservations--not everyone's "cuppa."

I had tastings of several under $20 wines at a wine shop Thursday evening (only the briefest of notes.) I will probably not get around to posting them until Monday.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Tim York » Sat Mar 15, 2014 6:39 am

David M. Bueker wrote:2009 Louis Jadot Moulin-à-Vent Château des Jacques - France, Burgundy, Beaujolais, Moulin-à-Vent (3/13/2014)
Last time I had this (2/2011) I said I would wait 5 years to have it again. Well after 2 years I broke down, and it was a mistake. This is still dark and now it is into a brooding phase. There's still great depth, so I will try and restrain myself for the other three years before I open my other bottles.


When I've tasted Jadot's Beaujolais range young, I haven't enjoyed them because they don't have the "fun" character which I look for in my Bojo and betray too often the presence of new oak. I've never bought any. They may indeed age impressively into serious wines but for that I look to other regions, which IMO do it better, two of which are not too far away from Beaujolais to the North and South.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Sun Mar 16, 2014 11:38 am

JC-this was the straight M-a-V.

Tim-I mostly agree with you, but I tend not to mind a serious, more Pinot-esque Beaujolais once in a while.
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Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon

by Robin Garr » Sun Mar 16, 2014 10:53 pm

Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon ($14.99)

Wine "geeks" will enjoy a bit of trivia about the rather obscure Saint-Bris wine region: It's in Burgundy - a near neighbor of Chablis in the far northern end of the Bourgogne (Burgundy) region, but it's a Sauvignon Blanc, an outlier in an appellation where virtually all white wines are made with Chardonnay. The climate and geology of Saint-Bris - its terroir - bear a kinship with Sancerre and other Loire Sauvignon Blancs, even though the region lies within the boundaries of Bourgogne. It's a clear, straw-color wine, with good aromatic fruit aromas, citrus - grapefruit and a hint or orange - and a distinct note of ripe peach. Simple but fresh white fruit carries over on the palate with light 12.4% acidity, shaped by zippy, mouth-watering acidity that makes it a fine companion with food, if a bit too tart to be an ideal candidate for aperitif-style sipping. A lemon-squirt citric snap lingers in the long finish. U.S. importer: Vanguard Wines LLC, Columbus, Ohio. (March 10, 2014)

FOOD MATCH: The winery website specifically suggests "salade de chèvre, salade niçoise." We had some excellent Capriole Indiana goat cheese on hand, and sure enough, bits of it were just fine with the wine, served in a salad with a vinaigrette of good olive oil and a gentle touch of lemon. It would be fine, too, with seafood or flavorful fish; and it made an excellent companion with the Asian flavors of a stir-fry of napa cabbage, onions and fresh, organic and GMO-free five-spice tofu house-made at Louisville's Heart & Soy.

WHEN TO DRINK: The winery suggests that it may be cellared for three to five years under good storage conditions, so there's no hurry to drink it. .

VALUE: It's a quality table white at this mid-teens price, which marks the national median for this wine at Wine-Searcher.com. It may be worth comparison-shopping, though, as Wine-Searcher.com lists a few vendors offering it for $2 or $3 less.

WEB LINK: The Jean-Marc Brocard website is available in French and English.
http://www.brocard.fr/
Click here for a fact sheet in French on the Saint-Bris Sauvignon.
http://www.boutique-brocard.fr/vins-de- ... -bris.html

FIND THIS WINE ONLINE:
Find vendors and check prices for Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon on Wine-Searcher.com.
http://www.wine-searcher.com/find/jean- ... g_site=WLP
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Mar 17, 2014 12:22 am

Just opened my third bottle from Saint Mont, Plaimont. The 2011 Les Vignes Retrouvees, blend of Gros Manseng Petit Courbou and Arrufiac.
Citrus on the nose, mainly grapefruit as before. Apple, quite bracing though.
Dry entry, grapefruit on the long finish. "Tart citrus" from across the table, some peach as it airs. The chalk is still noted, not much RS here. $17 Cdn.
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Re: Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon

by David M. Bueker » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:36 am

Robin Garr wrote:Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon ($14.99)


I used to buy their Chablis for $15. It's now $25. :(
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Re: Jean-Marc Brocard 2011 Saint-Bris Sauvignon

by Robin Garr » Mon Mar 17, 2014 9:55 am

David M. Bueker wrote:
Robin Garr wrote:Jean-Marc Brocard


I used to buy their Chablis for $15. It's now $25. :(

Interesting data point on the discussion about where the cutoff point for "good value" falls.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Mon Mar 17, 2014 10:10 am

At $25 Brocard's Chablis is not a good value.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Robin Garr » Mon Mar 17, 2014 2:19 pm

David M. Bueker wrote:At $25 Brocard's Chablis is not a good value.

That's what I meant. :lol:
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by David M. Bueker » Mon Mar 17, 2014 5:07 pm

Well some $25 wines are still very good value. The Brocard Chablis not so much.
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Robin Garr » Mon Mar 17, 2014 6:21 pm

David M. Bueker wrote:Well some $25 wines are still very good value. The Brocard Chablis not so much.

I can't disagree, but then we end up at the old debate about whether Ch. d'Yquem is a QPR wine because it outperforms competitors at its price point.

So my question is, what cutoff can we set that represents not only "value" but "affordability." If Brocard Chablis is a great value at $15 but not so much at $25, that suggests a criterion somewhere between those levels. :mrgreen:
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Re: March Wine Focus - Wine Values ($20 and under)

by Jenise » Mon Mar 17, 2014 8:26 pm

So last night I had three other couples over for dinner. We tasted 12 different under $20 wines for the purpose of picking finalists for this Friday night's neighborhood tasting that we're calling March Madness. Some were recommended to me by local store wine stewards, and several I picked from the shelftalkers. Interesting tasting with as many different palates as there people--we didn't find much that mutually pleased us, and only two wines got unanimous support on the first draft. Really brief notes on several wines:

Whites:

1) 2011 Sagelands Chardonnay, Washington: this is one of the two unanimous YES wines. Just $9 a bottle, and it's got great balance with terrific fruit and little to no oak. Even the oak lovers loved it. Really captures the spirit of the kind of wine value we want to present on Friday night.

2) 2012 Aviary Chardonnay, Napa Valley: $15: heavy and overly sweet after the Sagelands. No fans.

3) 2011 Qupe Chardonnay: I threw them this one for another perspective. Richer than the Sagelands without the ponderous weight of the Aviary. Doesn't quality for the price point on March Madness, but it would have been a unanimous YES were it otherwise.

Reds, all served blind and in random order to remove all bias:

1) NV Tarima (Spain): purple, dense, grapey, carbonic maceration, tastes remotely like Grenache but it's monastrell. Eight NO's.

2) 2011 Aviary Cabernet Sauvignon, Napa: Once again I thought we might be drinking Grenache--tasted like a cheap, light wine and it lacked any specific varietal character. On the first vote it got 7 YES and 1 NO (me). After the reveal, in which we learned it was a $20 Napa Cab, the revote got 8 NO's.

3) 2012 Blazon Pinot Noir, Lodi: smokey nose, spicy, cloves, low tannins, sweet finish. Personally, I hated it but I actually think it will do quite well at the tasting, so I was one of the five YES voters. That went to eight on the retaste later.

4) 2011 Atteca Old Vines (grenache, Spain): Big, fruity, smoky toasted oak with rich sweet fruit and good structure. This is the kind of wine that goes over big with our group. The other uninanimous YES vote on the first go-round.

5) 2012 Canoe Ridge Expedition, Washington: Mostly merlot, nice sweet fruit with a hint of green bean, easy to drink, low tannins. It didn't amaze but we could use it. Four YES, four NO.

6) 2011 Kenwood Cabernet: Vegetal, with a paint-stripper finish. Eight NO's, but Bob's and my favorite upon retasting all the contestants a day later.

7) 2012 Josh, California (possibly Napa, can't remember): Red licorice fruit, grapey, vegetables. Eight No's.

8 ) 2010 Guigal Cotes du Rhone: Berry fruit, balanced, good acid, interesting stuff going on. Six YES's.

9) 2011 Wente Cabernet, Southern Hills, Livermore: Wente's chardonnays always show so well in blind tastings that I took a chance on this red. I personally wouldn't mind drinking it, but I don't think it qualifies as a Best Value in Bellingham and I don't see it making much cash at the tasting (each taster is going to get a bag of pennies to 'tip' their favorite wines with). Three YES, five NO.
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