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Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

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Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Robin Garr » Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:40 am

We're celebrating the Loire this month, holding up all the wines of the Loire. White, pink or red, dry, moelleux or sweet, Chenin Blanc or Cabernet Franc, Pinot Noir or Pineau d'Aunis or the Melon of M- M- Mus- ... oh, you know. If it's from the Loire, bring it! If you live in a part of the world where Loire wines are hard to find, then bring a local example of a Loire varietal; but these wines are widely loved and should be available everywhere.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Jun 01, 2015 12:13 pm

2009 Chereau-Carre Muscadet de Sevre-et-Maine Chateau l`Oiseliniere de la Ramee.

I have been drinking every vintage of the Ramee available here since the early `00s and never had a duff bottle.

Good natural cork, 12 % alc, $20 Cdn, served quite chilled, with snapper fillets and seared prawns.

Comments reflect my thoughts on a bottle opened earlier this year. The color is a light lemon, nose had typical aromatics....crisp green apples, sea shore nuances, minerals, hint of gooseberry. Entry is dry, long finish, seemed to have some petillance without being to the forefront. Tart citrus, "very refreshing and still a good length" from across the table.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:25 pm

Here are two very different Muscadets drunk on successive days.

2013 Gadais Pere & Fils Muscadet de Sèvre-et-Maine La Grande Réserve du Moulin - France, Loire Valley, Pays Nantais, Muscadet de Sèvre-et-Maine (5/31/2015)
A delicious pairing for a sea food platter in a restaurant. Light/medium bodied, juicy citrus fruit, minerals, crisp but non-astringent acidity and a saline backbone which was a perfect foil for some iodine full oysters. Good+.

The restaurant was in Trouville just opposite the fish market halles and naturally we couldn't resist the temptation to buy more fish including a couple of succulent Breton lobsters together with a special Muscadet to go with them from from an excellent nearby caviste open on Sunndays.

2009 Pierre-Luc Bouchaud Muscadet de Sèvre-et-Maine Pont Caffino - France, Loire Valley, Pays Nantais, Muscadet de Sèvre-et-Maine (6/1/2015)
This Muscadet was aged for several years on its lees and is intended to be drunk mature. Being only light in colour with green tints and light/medium weight in body, its charms may escape the attention of those liking something more spectacular. There is a clear family resemblance to the lightish, fresh, mineral and salty young Muscadets that we quaff with fresh seafood but the fruit was more gracious with a creamy touch which might recall Chardonnay were it not for the sea breeze aromas and saline spine which were definitely Muscadet but the whole was better integrated, more complex and more refined than with young quaffers. It went well with cold lobster with mayonnaise and sauce Vincent and stood up well to a ripe Ste.Maure goat cheese. Very good.

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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Rahsaan » Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:09 pm

This weekend opened my second bottle of 2012 Pierre-Bise Savennières Roche aux Moines and pretty much felt just like the first. Firm and polished with a bit of fine-grained elegant breed, but overall not much going on right now. I guess I'll wait on the last bottle.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:33 pm

So how long will you wait Rahsaan...8 yrs or so :D .
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:39 pm

Tim above talks about a Muscadet aged a few yrs on the lees. Here is a note that I posted a while back on the 2002 Origine!!

WTN: 2002 Domaine Haut-Bourg Origine, Cotes de Grandlieu.

I remember a very nice `01 from the Choblet. Here is the newest release after 10 years on the lees! Diam-type cork? 12% alc, $22 Cdn.

Medium lemon in color, no gold at all.
More floral and fruit than sea shells on the nose. Still very bright tones here and appealing with its vibrancy. "Quite peach forward' from across the table.
Entry is quite off-dry, orange and peach. Some very nice citrus and pineapple on mid-palate. Very good acidity, creamy, long appealing finish. No teeth-enamel removal here folks.
The minerality shows up better if served not too chilled. Nice with roasted pork tenderloin.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Rahsaan » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:42 pm

Bob Parsons Alberta wrote:So how long will you wait Rahsaan...8 yrs or so :D .


Who knows. I'm sure that wouldn't hurt. But whether it will be worth it is another story.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:04 am

Rahsaan wrote:
Bob Parsons Alberta wrote:So how long will you wait Rahsaan...8 yrs or so :D .


Who knows. I'm sure that wouldn't hurt. But whether it will be worth it is another story.


In my experience Savennières is an unreliable ager but with luck can be superb in the 10-15 years old range and perhaps older. Recently a Ch.de Chamboureau Roche aux Moines C.de l"Avant 2002 had aged badly and was tired and dull;, if not premoxed. I had better luck with my bottles of Closel Papillon 2002, which were excellent, but read that others had premox. Finally a stash of 3 dozen Ch.d'Epiré containing 90s, 95s and 96s was very disappointing; about two-thirds of the bottles were dull at best and oxidised at worst after about 8 years old. Perhaps relative newcomers like Éric Morgat and Damien Laureau can do better.

I owned a few bottles of the Pierre-Bise straight Savennières 1997. When it was young, a friend took it for Condrieu because it was so round and richly fruity but it didn't age well becoming dark and dull after about 5 years. The last bottle went down the sink. That may not be typical because 1997 was a hot low acidity vintage.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:24 am

Because of the size of the Loire valley and its tributaries, I think it might be useful to revive a brief note which I posted a few years ago.

Most people here probably know that, as a wine region, the Loire valley is far from homogeneous. It can be more accurately described as four distinct regions.

Moving from east to west there is the “Centre”, where for whites Sauvignon blanc is king and for reds Pinot Noir.

Then there is “Touraine”, where Chenin blanc predominates for whites and Cabernet franc for reds with some different grape varieties, e.g. Romorantin, Côt (Malbec), Gamay, SB...., and combinations thereof appearing mostly in some of its eastern appellations like Cour-Cheverny, Touraine-Amboise....

“Anjou-Saumur” uses mainly Cabernet franc, Chenin and Gamay like Touraine but the whites in particular have their own style.

Finally the “Pays Nantais” close to the Loire’s estuary is most famous for Muscadet produced from the Melon de Bourgogne grape.

The distance from Nantes to Cosne-sur-Loire (near Sancerre) is about 440 km by road and further by the river because of its long loop north though Orléans with the climate become progressively more continental as one moves further from the Atlantic near Nantes. Here is a crude map of the Loire valley’s principle appellations http://www.terroirs-france.com/vin/loire_carte.htm .

The two most similar of these regions are “Touraine” and “Anjou-Saumur” and to many Loire lovers they represent the heartland for Loire wines. In Touraine, famous appellations are Vouvray, Montlouis and Jasnières (white) and Chinon, Bourgueil and St.Nicolas Bourgueil (red) and, in Anjou-Saumur, Savennières, Coteaux du Layon and their micro-appellations like Coulée de Serrant (white) together with Saumur-Champigny (red). I hazard a guess that at least as much red is produced as white in Anjou-Saumur and Touraine, although it can be argued that more of the whites from Chenin are truly world class than the reds from Cabernet franc. Even in the “Pays Nantais”, reds are produced, e.g. Coteaux d’Ancenis from Gamay, while in the “Centre”, main SB appellations being Sancerre, Pouilly-Fumé, Pouilly-sur-Loire, Menetou-Salon....., some producers are getting increasingly ambitious with Pinot Noir reds and some Pinot Noir based rosé is truly celestial.

Even further upstream than the "Centre" towards the river's source in the Auvergne, good wine is grown at Saint-Pourçain-sur-Sioule from mainly Chardonnay, Gamay and Pinot Noir, and in the Côte Roannaise and Côtes -du-Forez mainly from Gamay. For some reason people don't seem to think of these as Loire wines.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Rahsaan » Tue Jun 02, 2015 8:59 am

Tim York wrote:I owned a few bottles of the Pierre-Bise straight Savennières 1997. When it was young, a friend took it for Condrieu because it was so round and richly fruity but it didn't age well becoming dark and dull after about 5 years. The last bottle went down the sink. That may not be typical because 1997 was a hot low acidity vintage.


Yes, and Claude was very aware of these problems and working to mitigate them with different pressing and other tactics. (I only talked with him at the beginning of his thinking on this problem)

From what I tasted of his two 2012s, they do seem more graceful, with less obvious alcohol and an overall lighter touch than his previous efforts from the late 90s and early 00s. Not sure how that will affect the aging curve(s). Plus 2012 was so rainy, which may explain the relatively light concentration, so not sure how that plays into it either.

A voir.
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WTN: 2008 Pinon Moelleux

by David M. Bueker » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:52 pm

2008 François Pinon Vouvray Moelleux - France, Loire Valley, Touraine, Vouvray (6/2/2015)
This is a big wine. It also has a great deal of acidity, keeping it more lively than many Moelleux wines I have had in the past. The aromatics are currently dominated by vanilla and spices, with a bit of honey and pineapple poking through. The botrytis is even more evident on the palate where there is also a distinct note of black tea. This is a very complex and interesting wine right now, though my remaining bottles are going to get buried or sent to offsite storage because there is lots to look forward to.
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Loire-related news

by Rahsaan » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:21 pm

Since we're generating Loire discussion, a couple of news items from another board. They may not be news to you, but they were news to me.

1. The recent string of bad vintages has been a financial disaster for the Loire vignerons. The Pinon Case was widely talked about (and sold) in the US, but apparently Chidaine has been having serious financial issues as well and his fellow vignerons did an auction on his behalf:

http://www.vitisphere.com/breve-72535-Gens-du-vin-Solidarite-une-vente-aux-encheres-pour-aider-le-vigneron-Francois-Chidaine.html

2. More Chidaine problems, this time getting the AOC Vouvray:

http://jimsloire.blogspot.fr/2015/06/vouvray-trying-to-blot-jacky-and.html
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:32 pm

Great discussion all round and terrific primer from Tim eh. Just decanted the 2009 Cuvee Terroir from Joguet so stay tuned. Have any J Rahsaan?

https://www.kermitlynch.com/our-wines/charles-joguet/
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by David M. Bueker » Tue Jun 02, 2015 9:53 pm

Thanks for the update Rahsaan. I have been wondering how the vintners were making out.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Rahsaan » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:13 pm

Bob Parsons Alberta wrote:Have any J Rahsaan?


I don't buy Loire cabernet franc anymore, so no, I have no Joguet! Not because the wines aren't delicious, I just decided to focus on other red wine regions I prefer (Beaujolais, Burgundy, Northern Rhone, ESJ, and Piedmont)

Even when I was buying Loire cab franc, towards the end it was mainly Baudry, so I haven't much exposure to Joguet recently. But I'm sure the 09 Terroir was a nice drink.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:52 pm

Thanks Rahsaan, understand! More Joguet here than Baudry...have to go to BC for that :( .
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Re: Loire-related news

by Tim York » Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:38 am

Rahsaan wrote:Since we're generating Loire discussion, a couple of news items from another board. They may not be news to you, but they were news to me.

1. The recent string of bad vintages has been a financial disaster for the Loire vignerons. The Pinon Case was widely talked about (and sold) in the US, but apparently Chidaine has been having serious financial issues as well and his fellow vignerons did an auction on his behalf:

http://www.vitisphere.com/breve-72535-Gens-du-vin-Solidarite-une-vente-aux-encheres-pour-aider-le-vigneron-Francois-Chidaine.html

2. More Chidaine problems, this time getting the AOC Vouvray:

http://jimsloire.blogspot.fr/2015/06/vouvray-trying-to-blot-jacky-and.html


Thanks for this information, Rahsaan.

The first story is very interesting. It would indeed be sad if a vigneron as talented as Chidaine went under financially and it is great to read that the UGM are rallying round him. I feel for vignerons in similar predicament but without his fame, who will find it much more difficult to get support.

As for the second story, if it weren't happening in France, I would be looking for an April 1 date. People here seem to have an overdeveloped protectionist gene in their DNA. In the case of Jacky Blot and François Chidaine who are acknowledged as outstanding producers, I guess that it won't harm them one jot. But again I feel for the younger and less well known who may be doing the same thing. I wonder whether the Vouvray producers would be doing this mean thing if Noël Pinguet were still active at Huet.

BTW I am just reading RVF's 2014 vintage report and they are so enthusiastic about it in the Loire valley that they say that most lesser producers should also produce good wine. I feel tempted to rush to Blot and Chidaine to buy a lot of their "vin de table" but somehow I doubt whether they will offer a good discount.
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Domaine des Corbillières 2014 Touraine Rosé

by Robin Garr » Fri Jun 05, 2015 5:20 pm

Domaine des Corbillières 2014 Touraine Rosé ($15.99)

Here's a tart and food-friendly Loire rosé made from a blend of 70% Pinot Noir and 30% Pineau d'Aunis. It's a clear, pale salmon color, light pink with an orange hue. Gentle red berries and fresh green herbs, faintly reminiscent of basil leaves, make for an inviting aroma. Crisp and dry, a touch of strawberry meets a squirt of lemon on the palate, tart and refreshing, 13% alcohol. Very good with food. U.S. importer: Robert Kacher Selections, NYC. (June 3, 2015)

FOOD MATCH: For food pairing, think of it as a crisp, tart white wine and take it just about anywhere an acidic white would go: seafood and fish, lighter chicken dishes, summer salads. It was fine with a dinner salad with a vinaigrette (generous with the oil, light with the lemon) and thin slices of Parmigiano-Reggiano.

WHEN TO DRINK: In general, rosés are most delicious when fresh, best drunk up the year after the vintage. There's no need to dump older pinks; though. A year or two stored in a cool place might not help it, but it won't hurt it, either.

VALUE: I'd like its value a bit more in the lower teens (Wine-Searcher.com lists a $14 average U.S. retail price), but I'm not actively wailing about this price point.

WEB LINKS The winery website is available in French and English. Here's a fact sheet on the Touraine Rosé.

The importer's site also offers lots of great info on the fact sheet at this link.

FIND THIS WINE ONLINE:
Compare prices and find vendors for Domaine des Corbillières 2014 Touraine Rosé on Wine-Searcher.com.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Fri Jun 05, 2015 8:38 pm

WTN: 2009 Charles Joguet Chinon Cuvee Terroir, Loire Valley.

Cellared 2 yrs, good natural cork, decanted, $28 Cdn, 13% alc. "Rented vineyards, mainstay of production"..Richard Kelly.

No sign of any age on the rim, light to medium purple with a medium ruby core. No brett on the nose!! Pepper, cherry, raspberry, quite herbal in tone. "Not that ripe..think more blackberry" from across the table. Did not develop much on the nose day 2.
Initial entry thought was low tannins, ready to go! Some herbal and green pepper notes, lengthy finish which was tad riper on day 2. Thought could have used some more black and red fruits initially, can understand why some people are not big Cab Franc fans. More pepper tones on day 2 with riper fruit on mid-palate and finish.

**** food was pork schnitzel, creamy mushroom gravy with bok choy.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:29 am

Bob, that sounds a disappointingly vegetal showing for 2009, a generally ripe year. "Terroir" is an entry level cuvée but it should shine in a vintage like that. If it had been 2011, 2012 or even 2008, then a normal showing, but I was surprised at the Salon des Vignerons Indépendants last year how good were the '11 top cuvées like Dioterie.

PS Just off in a few minutes to Paris to attend the Salon of La Revue du Vin de France. A disappointingly poor line-up from the Loire :( has been announced.

Second PS while waiting for my train. Just visited the Joguet website and am shocked by the prices they are now asking for Dioterie and Chêne Vert, e.g. CV 2009 at €42 ex-cellar :shock: . Not so long ago it was about €22 :? . At €42, it is priced at the same level or more than many Médoc 3rds and 4ths. Of course it punches at least at that level qualitatively but the charm of the Loire used to be great QPR. The latest Cuvée Terroir costs €9.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:19 am

This `09 Joguet did not come close the Baudry tasted last year. Good luck in Paris Tim.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Sun Jun 07, 2015 1:54 pm

Here's an example of how unsatisfactory aged Savennières can be.

1995 Château d'Epiré Savennières Cuvée Spéciale - France, Loire Valley, Anjou-Saumur, Savennières (6/7/2015)
My last dry bottle of an unsatisfactory series of mid-90s vintages bought at the estate. This one was par for the poor course. Deep golden colour, very oxidative with notes of nuts, honey and a little wax, lively acidity and a long but sourly cloying finish which I can still taste. I have taken out another bottles for dinner's turbot and may use this with cooking.
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I tasted at the Closel stand yesterday and a young man there said that oxidation is a common problem with Savennières which can be prevented by re-corking!? The owner Madame de Pontbriand was listening in with interest but did not interject. What wine owner other than the estate has the resources for that?

I hope that the Bellivière Jasnières Les Rosiers '07 now waiting will restore my faith in Loire Chenin.
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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by Tim York » Sun Jun 07, 2015 4:02 pm

This is what Loire chenin should be; one of the world's great whites. I have nothing to add or subtract from my TN if about a year ago including the pairings which were the same. Alas my last bottle :( but I think I caught it at its peak :D .

2007 Domaine de Bellivière Jasnières Les Rosiers - France, Loire Valley, Jasnières (7/4/2014 & 6/8/2015)
This was a lovely example of dry Loire chenin, which revealed new facets as the wine aired and warmed; indeed best at about 16C which is well above the temperature conventionally recommended for a white. Colour was medium/deep yellow. The nose was expressive with mineral and white fruit (e.g.peach, pineapple) to the fore and a distant background of wax, spice and quince. The palate was subjectively dry, superbly focussed, long, medium bodied and aromatically expressive with moreish lively acidity, perhaps a touch of RS (6g/l?), lively fruit and minerals, a generously burnished undertow, which is more frequent in demi-sec than dry, and a saline hint giving structure to the finish. Lovely with turbot and exceptional with Touraine goat cheeses.

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Re: Wine Focus for June: The Loire!

by David M. Bueker » Sun Jun 07, 2015 4:05 pm

Tim-did you just recently have a bottle of it?
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