Bill Spohn
He put the 'bar' in 'barrister'
10704
Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 pm
Vancouver BC
David M. Bueker
Childless Cat Dad
35995
Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:52 am
Connecticut
Bill Spohn
He put the 'bar' in 'barrister'
10704
Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 pm
Vancouver BC
David M. Bueker wrote:Interesting notes. I am intrigued by the '93 Closel note, as I had a '97 Closel Savennieres over the weekend. It smelled like fermented garbage and tasted worse (and yes most of the geeks tasted it). I've had very good luck with aging Savennieres in my cellar, but I tend to see a lot of cooked/compromised stuff around.
Bill Spohn wrote:Morals – whites are better than reds in the Loire. Whites age beautifully. Loire whites mate with Japanese cuisine passably well (easy on the wasabi). Fascinating tasting.
Felix Warners
Wine geek
72
Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:55 pm
Netherlands, Zandvoort and Zeist
David M. Bueker wrote:Interesting notes. I am intrigued by the '93 Closel note, as I had a '97 Closel Savennieres over the weekend. It smelled like fermented garbage and tasted worse (and yes most of the geeks tasted it). I've had very good luck with aging Savennieres in my cellar, but I tend to see a lot of cooked/compromised stuff around.
Bill Spohn wrote:2002 Damien Laureau Savennieres Les Genets – new age Savennieres. Darker, with a rich honeyed nose with some botrytis, then surprisingly light on palate, delicate even, finishing with a hint of oxidation and a fair bit of acidity. Not sure I like these higher alcohol early drinking versions as much as the traditional style.
David M. Bueker
Childless Cat Dad
35995
Thu Mar 23, 2006 11:52 am
Connecticut
Bill Spohn wrote:These wines should make old bones. In fact they NEED to have age to allow the acidity to abate so that they are enjoyable. That notwithstanding, I have also observed some 'duds'. One that comes to mind is the 1993 Closel Papillon, which seemed to be breaking up a few years ago. I must haul a bottle out and try it but I don't hold much hope that it will somehow have reformed itself.
Bill Spohn
He put the 'bar' in 'barrister'
10704
Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 pm
Vancouver BC
Felix Warners
Wine geek
72
Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:55 pm
Netherlands, Zandvoort and Zeist
David M. Bueker wrote:Welcome Felix! I'm really not sure how the '97 Closel was treated, so keep an eye on your bottles. I know I am going to be checking in frequently.
Felix Warners wrote:Joly, Closel, Laroche and a few more estates in the Savennières made wines last year that go to 15% in alcohol...I'm curious if this ripe trend will procede or that was due to warm vintages like 2003 and 2005.
Bill Spohn wrote:1995 Foreau Vouvray Clod Naudin Moelleux..a 12% RS..
Bill Spohn
He put the 'bar' in 'barrister'
10704
Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:31 pm
Vancouver BC
Rahsaan wrote:Bill Spohn wrote:1995 Foreau Vouvray Clod Naudin Moelleux..a 12% RS..
I'm not familiar with this notation, I usually see it quoted in grams per liter. What does 12% RS mean?
Bill Spohn wrote:FYI, 100 g/l = 10% (as 1 litre of water is 1 kilo) So 12% is the same as 120 g/l or the same level required for a 5 Put Tokay, just to give you some idea.
Felix Warners wrote:A few months ago I had a big tasting with Nicolas Joly and we had a brilliant line up. I asked him if he thought the fact that the wines have now 14-15%alcohol will make these wines more approacheble young since they are so ripe but less good to cellar. He said it made no difference and that he thought these wines would be perfect still in 20years. The Coulee de Serrant 1989, 1990 and 1996 of Joly are such magnificient wines I hope his recent vintages will be like that also in a few years but I have my doubts. A bottle of his Savenniere The "Clos de la Bergerie" 2004 I had 2 tweeks ago was at opening a brilliant wine, complex, ripe etc. After one night in the fridge the remaining of this wine has changed in colour from golden yellow to almost dark brownish and had lost all his freshness.
Joly, Closel, Laroche and a few more estates in the Savennières made wines last year that go to 15% in alcohol. Baumard is one of the few that still manages to keep the alcohol "low". For me the young Baumard wines I had brought less "thunder" than the wines from Joly and Closel but the older Baumards I drank were like a dream. I'm a bit worried and have started opening bottles of recent vintages from all the winemakers that produced Savennières with 14-15% alcohol because I think this ripe style wont improve to much with age, although I hope im terribly wrong. I havent had any 2006 and wont buy any since all my money is spend on german Riesling but I'm curious if this ripe trend will procede or that was due to warm vintages like 2003 and 2005.
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