WTN: 1985 Huet, 2004 Chidaine

1985 Huet Clos du Bourg Vouvray Moelleux
Firm golden citrus mineral fruit. The acidity is not as brisk or sharp as another bottle from 2 months ago, which is nice, but it lacks the textural depth and energy that would get me more excited. Fine enough bottle but nothing I am motivated to finish.

2004 Chidaine Montlouis-sur-Loire Les Choisilles
Nowhere near as exciting as some of the previous vintages I have enjoyed of this bottling. Those were racy crisp and fresh, this is soft, sweet, and caramelly. I don't know if that is the oak treatment taking over or what. It does offer pleasure when it is colder and there is more electricity to the cotton fuzzy kumquat stuff, but as it warms the caramel weighs it down.

[David M. Bueker]

The caramel in the Chidaine sounds like some level of oxidation.

The caramel in the Chidaine sounds like some level of oxidation.

Interesting. Thanks. Whether it is oak or oxidation, I was thinking perhaps that the energetic fruit of 'youth' had dropped out and let the caramel take over. Regardless of the cause it is not promising and fits in with the discussion among Disorderlies where some are arguing that Chidaine's work in general has deteriorated since 04 and the acquisition of all the new property. I don't have comprehensive tasting experience to weigh in, but with my limited data points this fits that argument.

[David M. Bueker]

Well the 2005s sure are good. I bought virtually all of them (I missed one) & have been enjoying them all.

Well the 2005s sure are good. I bought virtually all of them (I missed one) & have been enjoying them all.

Sounds good. I haven't had enough. I only had one or two, and it was early and they were too sweet and heavy, but such was the vintage and I was assuming better things would come. Now I am wondering if I should question that assumption, but as always, time and tasting will tell!

[David M. Bueker]

All in all I would rather buy Huet (even if they are standing still ha ha ha), but I want to age the Huet, so the Chidaine is there for me when I want a Chenin fix.

Huet (even if they are standing still ha ha ha)

I didn't get the wordplay. I even tried pronouncing Huet like a pirate, to no avail...

1985 Huet Clos du Bourg Vouvray Moelleux
Firm golden citrus mineral fruit. The acidity is not as brisk or sharp as another bottle from 2 months ago, which is nice, but it lacks the textural depth and energy that would get me more excited. Fine enough bottle but nothing I am motivated to finish.

2004 Chidaine Montlouis-sur-Loire Les Choisilles
Nowhere near as exciting as some of the previous vintages I have enjoyed of this bottling. Those were racy crisp and fresh, this is soft, sweet, and caramelly. I don't know if that is the oak treatment taking over or what. It does offer pleasure when it is colder and there is more electricity to the cotton fuzzy kumquat stuff, but as it warms the caramel weighs it down.

I think that I have a bottle/bottles of the Huet 85. How sweet is it? Has the RS been absorbed sufficiently to drink it with a richly sauced chicken or fish dish? When I bought the caviste warned not to expect super sweetness.

I tasted a few of Chidaine's 04s at his Montlouis shop, la Cave Insolite. Although it was a weak vintage in Touraine, I thought that most showed well in a light vein and I bought a few, particularly Vouvray, which are now all gone with enjoyment, but they are not a patch on the 02s and 05s.

Incidentally, based on recent tastings, I too do not subscribe to the view that Chidaine is going downhill.

[David M. Bueker]

Huet (even if they are standing still ha ha ha)

I didn't get the wordplay. I even tried pronouncing Huet like a pirate, to no avail...

It's a reference to a thread on another board.

I think that I have a bottle/bottles of the Huet 85. How sweet is it? Has the RS been absorbed sufficiently to drink it with a richly sauced chicken or fish dish? When I bought the caviste warned not to expect super sweetness.

I think it is definitely possible to match with some foods although I don't know your personal preferences for these things. It still definitely has a good whack of sugar that must be taken into account, sort of like a young demi-sec level although obviously the texture is so different from the age that I wouldn't really compare it to a young demi-sec. I paired my first bottle with tuna steaks and a sweet corn turmeric sauce and it was a great match for my tastes. There is a very healthy acidic streak that helps balance the sweetness.

I tasted a few of Chidaine's 04s at his Montlouis shop, la Cave Insolite. Although it was a weak vintage in Touraine, I thought that most showed well in a light vein and I bought a few, particularly Vouvray, which are now all gone with enjoyment..

I guess these might have given more pleasure in the past than in the future.

The caramel in the Chidaine sounds like some level of oxidation.

Interesting. Thanks. Whether it is oak or oxidation, I was thinking perhaps that the energetic fruit of 'youth' had dropped out and let the caramel take over. Regardless of the cause it is not promising and fits in with the discussion among Disorderlies where some are arguing that Chidaine's work in general has deteriorated since 04 and the acquisition of all the new property. I don't have comprehensive tasting experience to weigh in, but with my limited data points this fits that argument.

I have not really looked into this but according to http://www.awri.com.au/industry_development/additives/default.asp?additive=7 caramel is an acceptable color additive for wine in France.

I have not really looked into this but according to http://www.awri.com.au/industry_development/additives/default.asp?additive=7 caramel is an acceptable color additive for wine in France.

Although my intuition tells me that doesn' t apply in this case, nonetheless it is very interesting (and sad).

Regardless of the cause it is not promising and fits in with the discussion among Disorderlies where some are arguing that Chidaine's work in general has deteriorated since 04 and the acquisition of all the new property. I don't have comprehensive tasting experience to weigh in, but with my limited data points this fits that argument.

Hmm. I can't say that I have extensive experience, but I really thought the '05 Clos Habert and Tuffeaux were excellent, as long as you like the vintage style. I'm sure others have more experience, but I'm quite happy with my purchases.

I have not really looked into this but according to http://www.awri.com.au/industry_development/additives/default.asp?additive=7 caramel is an acceptable color additive for wine in France.

Although my intuition tells me that doesn' t apply in this case, nonetheless it is very interesting (and sad).

I think that you can relax, Rahsaan. It says that caramel is permitted in wines imported into the EU. I can't find any reference to its being allowed in AOC wine production. I will search French sources to see if I can get any further clarification.

I certainly suspect the presence of caramel in a lot of Cognac.

It says that caramel is permitted in wines imported into the EU..

Perhaps in cheap Date Wine or others of that genre..

It says that caramel is permitted in wines imported into the EU.

I should know better than to try to do something quick. I should have read more closely before posting.

Huet (even if they are standing still ha ha ha)

I didn't get the wordplay. I even tried pronouncing Huet like a pirate, to no avail...

It's a reference to a thread on another board.

I thought as much. PAB would be pleased, I'm sure.

Mark Lipton