The place for all things wine, focused on serious wine discussions.

WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

Moderators: Jenise, Robin Garr, David M. Bueker

no avatar
User

Tim York

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4927

Joined

Tue May 09, 2006 2:48 pm

Location

near Lisieux, France

WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Tim York » Sun Mar 29, 2009 7:05 am

Montepulciano d’Abruzzo “Spelt” 2001 – Fattoria La Valentina – Alc. 14.5% - (Approx. €20)

The story begins with a heroic struggle with the cork. Using my favourite waiters’ pocket corkscrew with a two stage lever, I worked hard to insert the screw but then could not budge the cork; fearing breaking the corkscrew, I switched to a screw-pull which threatened to remove the centre of the cork while leaving the sides still adhering to the neck of the bottle (this has happened to me before); finally a wider bladed two handled corkscrew was not long enough and only extracted the top two-thirds of the cork; after trying to chip away the remainder with a sharp steak knife, I pushed it in and decanted through a silver filter which was not fine enough to catch all the cork dust. This cork was surely hermetic!!

C: Deep ruby red with purple foam.
N: Well developed and complex with dark fruit and a curious tang like cheesy tar. (I usually associate cheese aromas with a wine going wrong but they were hardly perceptible on the palate and when I sniffed the neck of the bottle containing heeltaps they had disappeared and brambly fruit aromas were dominant. Was this a sort of reduction which needed a much earlier decant?)
P: Full bodied, deep and darkly fruity with brambly blackberry aromas coming out together with spicy and tangy tar, touches of liqueur laced fruit cake, good lively acidity, good structural support towards the finish and good length. This is a powerful and tasty wine but “classy”, “refined” and “elegant” are not descriptors which spring to mind; 16.5/20 with potential for 17/20+ if the cheesy note can be eliminated by more age/airing.

Here is a link to La Valentina’s informative website - http://www.lavalentina.it/ENG/index.htm . “Spelt” is not the estate’s top cuvée; the much more expensive “Binomio” 2001 was more massive, woody and muscle bound than this and “Binomio” 2000 decidedly odd. “Spelt” 2000 was much more harmonious than either “Binomio” and indeed than this 2001 on its present showing but probably has less potential.

To revert to my rhetorical question in the title line, Montepulciano provides some of my favourite robustly food friendly QPR reds in the under €10 bracket and a wine like this one and Masciarelli’s Marina Cvetic provide some deeper and more complex drinking well worth their price around €20. However, I am not convinced that the more luxury cuvées like La Valentina’s Binomio (which creeps up towards €40) and Masciarelli’s Villa Gemma (towards €60) do more than provide rather more volume of the same sensations sometimes to the detriment of balance and harmony. They can be hugely enjoyable but class and elegance prove elusive and I am wondering whether I will ever find one which I would rate more than about 17/20 on my personal scale. I still have left a bottle and magnum of this “Spelt” and a bottle of “Binomio” 2001 together with some Marina Cvetic 2001, 2003 and 2004 and Rosso Conero "Sassi Neri" from Le Terrazze to allow me to go on testing the potential of this grape type after more ageing.
Last edited by Tim York on Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Tim York
no avatar
User

Bob Parsons Alberta

Rank

aka Doris

Posts

10775

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 3:09 pm

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Bob Parsons Alberta » Sun Mar 29, 2009 10:20 am

Good question Tim. Have so little experience with this varietal, looking forward to being educated.
no avatar
User

Dan Donahue

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

359

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 5:02 pm

Location

IL

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Dan Donahue » Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:29 pm

Certainly Emidio Pepe gets raves for his Montepulcianos. (although there is supposedly a lot of bottle variation) I've had very good experiences with some aged Pepe Trebbianos--the '95 was an amazing wine--so I'm anxious to try some of the reds. Unfortunately all I've been able to land so far are the '01s. From what I can tell I have another 5-10 years to wait.
Je ne peux pas le faire
no avatar
User

Tim York

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4927

Joined

Tue May 09, 2006 2:48 pm

Location

near Lisieux, France

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Tim York » Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:07 pm

Thanks, Dan, for introducing me to a new name. I see from his website that he is a biodynamic producer - http://www.emidiopepe.com/public/DB5/La ... z2=&db=DB5 . This, I think, means low or no sulphur which could account for a lot of bottle variation. Gambero Rosso 2006 gives 2 bicchieri to the 2001 and I like the natural sound of the wines from their brief write-up.

This is one to look out for and perhaps visit.
Tim York
no avatar
User

Dave Erickson

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

808

Joined

Tue Jun 20, 2006 4:31 pm

Location

Asheville, NC

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Dave Erickson » Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:14 pm

Two words: Marina Cvetic.

Image
no avatar
User

Ryan M

Rank

Wine Gazer

Posts

1720

Joined

Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:01 pm

Location

Atchison, KS

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Ryan M » Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:27 pm

I enjoy Montepulciano immensely, but I haven't had any of the more "serious" ones, which as reported here are said to be very good. To me, the best qualities of Montepulciano are its delightful charm, its food friendliness, and perhaps, its lack of pretentiousness - a grape that should not be asked for greatness. I would surely love to try a more serious Montepulciano, but personally, I would never pay more than $15 for any Montepulciano. It's not that I think its not good enough, but rather, I don't want greatness from it - I want it to be low key and charming. Also, I think that the potential for greatness lies rather with other Italian grapes with similar qualities - Sangiovese, or perhaps even Nero d'Avola - the things that they share with Montepulciano, they do better, in my opinion. But all just my opinion mind you - and I'm sure if presented with a great Montepulciano, I would enjoy it.

But, now I'm curious, and I might just have to go out and spend a bit more on one sometime . . . .
"The sun, with all those planets revolving about it and dependent on it, can still ripen a bunch of grapes as if it had nothing else to do"
Galileo Galilei

(avatar: me next to the WIYN 3.5 meter telescope at Kitt Peak National Observatory)
no avatar
User

Tim York

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4927

Joined

Tue May 09, 2006 2:48 pm

Location

near Lisieux, France

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Tim York » Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:15 pm

Dave Erickson wrote:Two words: Marina Cvetic.


Dave, I agree the the red Marina Cvetic is excellent but none I have had were better than the La Valentina Spelt 2000; in other words complex, intense, hugely enjoyable and well worth the price but, IMHO, lacking the elegance and class to be really great.


Ryan Maderak wrote:To me, the best qualities of Montepulciano are its delightful charm, its food friendliness, and perhaps, its lack of pretentiousness - a grape that should not be asked for greatness. I would surely love to try a more serious Montepulciano, but personally, I would never pay more than $15 for any Montepulciano.


Ryan, I half agree with you but I do think that cuvées like Spelt and Marina Cvetic costing €20-25 here definitely have a lot extra, if not greatness. I don't think that ratcheting up the density and price to Binomio and Villa Gemma levels gets closer to greatness.


Ryan Maderak wrote: Also, I think that the potential for greatness lies rather with other Italian grapes with similar qualities - Sangiovese, or perhaps even Nero d'Avola -


In my book, Nebbiolo and Sangiovese make really great wines. I have not yet had a Nero d'Avola which suggests it has that potential; indeed, I would rate Montepulciano higher. On the other hand, I sense that Aglianico has potential for greatness in Taurasi and Vulture; they can have an impressively classy austerity though elegance and refinement are not appropriate descriptors. Sadly too many producers mask this quality with an "internationally" anonymous fruit and an obtrusive wood patina.
Tim York
no avatar
User

Ryan M

Rank

Wine Gazer

Posts

1720

Joined

Wed Jul 09, 2008 3:01 pm

Location

Atchison, KS

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Ryan M » Sun Mar 29, 2009 9:27 pm

Tim York wrote:
In my book, Nebbiolo and Sangiovese make really great wines. I have not yet had a Nero d'Avola which suggests it has that potential; indeed, I would rate Montepulciano higher. On the other hand, I sense that Aglianico has potential for greatness in Taurasi and Vulture; they can have an impressively classy austerity though elegance and refinement are not appropriate descriptors. Sadly too many producers mask this quality with an "internationally" anonymous fruit and an obtrusive wood patina.


Agree completely, except that I do think Nero d'Avola is going to show the world someday.
"The sun, with all those planets revolving about it and dependent on it, can still ripen a bunch of grapes as if it had nothing else to do"
Galileo Galilei

(avatar: me next to the WIYN 3.5 meter telescope at Kitt Peak National Observatory)
no avatar
User

Dale Williams

Rank

Compassionate Connoisseur

Posts

11158

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:32 pm

Location

Dobbs Ferry, NY (NYC metro)

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Dale Williams » Mon Mar 30, 2009 10:37 am

Dan Donahue wrote:Certainly Emidio Pepe gets raves for his Montepulcianos.


Yes, and the other "cult" Montepulciano d'A is Valentini (even harder to find, I've only heard of it).
no avatar
User

Tim York

Rank

Wine guru

Posts

4927

Joined

Tue May 09, 2006 2:48 pm

Location

near Lisieux, France

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Tim York » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:30 am

Dale Williams wrote:
Dan Donahue wrote:Certainly Emidio Pepe gets raves for his Montepulcianos.


Yes, and the other "cult" Montepulciano d'A is Valentini (even harder to find, I've only heard of it).


Yes, I long to try one. I read that his Trebbiano d'Abruzzo is also out of this world; it is an appellation which I have usually found quite boring.
Tim York
no avatar
User

Dan Donahue

Rank

Ultra geek

Posts

359

Joined

Thu Mar 23, 2006 5:02 pm

Location

IL

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Dan Donahue » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:43 am

Dale, I should have mentioned Valentini except I've never seen any of his reds. His Trebbiano d'Abruzzo is very good although I slightly prefer the Pepe.

Tim, I agree that Trebbiano can be boring in the wrong hands but you should try a Pepe or a Valentini with some age (10+?) sometime. I've scanned some discussions on whether they use a different Trebbiano grape, but I'm not sure what the ultimate conclusion was.

On a side note, so many of the native Italian red varieties need many years in the bottle to hit their peak and that makes exploration a very slow process unless you have access to a really great cellar. I have a number of bottles of Ruchè, Sagrantino and Aglianico that have been sleeping many years in my cellar and I'm still waiting.
Je ne peux pas le faire
no avatar
User

Dale Williams

Rank

Compassionate Connoisseur

Posts

11158

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:32 pm

Location

Dobbs Ferry, NY (NYC metro)

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Dale Williams » Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:15 pm

Dan Donahue wrote:Tim, I agree that Trebbiano can be boring in the wrong hands but you should try a Pepe or a Valentini with some age (10+?) sometime. I've scanned some discussions on whether they use a different Trebbiano grape, but I'm not sure what the ultimate conclusion was..


My understanding is that Trebbiano d'Abruzzo is in fact Bombino, and not closely related to Trebbiano/Ugni Blanc. Now whether Pepe and Valentini use a different grape (or clone) than others, I have no clue.
So you have folks in the region making Trebbiano d'Abruzzo (and people thinking it's related to Trebbiano Toscano) and Montepulciano d'Abruzzo (no relation whatsoever to Vino Nobile de Montepulciano ). ah, Italy! :)
no avatar
User

Saina

Rank

Musaroholic

Posts

3976

Joined

Tue Mar 21, 2006 4:07 pm

Location

Helsinki, Finland

Re: WTN: Is the Montepulciano grape capable of greatness?

by Saina » Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:22 pm

FWIW, two years ago we had a quick tasting (notes here) of the grape. I liked Valentini, but sadly some were truly offensive in their oaky spoofyness (Kurni was vile, even though this seems to be the most hyped). I would love to see more of the unpretentious ones here.
I don't drink wine because of religious reasons ... only for other reasons.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AhrefsBot, ClaudeBot, Google [Bot] and 3 guests

Powered by phpBB ® | phpBB3 Style by KomiDesign