WTN: '95 Pichon Baron

Tonight, I came home to find Jean preparing a dinner of ribeyes, corn on the cob and Tater Tots (catering to Andrew's food preferences) -- actually the steaks were waiting for me to grill, which I did. When we sat down to dinner, I was greeted with a brown-bagged bottle:

1995 Ch. Pichon-Longueville Baron Pauillac 2er
color: dark garnet center going brick on the edges
nose: initially, pencil lead and dark fruit; after a splash decant, mint and cedar
palate: somewhat closed in, cassis, slightly coarse tannins that softened after the decant

Of course, I was asked to guess what I was drinking. My first thought was Bordeaux, but I switched to a structured CalCab (of which we have a few) after failing to get much in the way of the secondary characteristics I usually get in Bordeaux (earthy, herbal) and getting clear Cabernet Sauvignon character. My final guess was of a '94 California Cabernet. When I saw that it was a '95 Pauillac, I didn't feel too bad about my guess, but I was still surprised at the relative simplicity of the wine. We saved half the bottle for later evaluation to see how it would evolve.

Mark Lipton

I’m not saying that I couldn’t mistake a Pichon Baron for a Cal Cab, but in my mind I don’t think it is possible. I have a ‘95 PB and by hook or crook I am going to have someone provide several glasses of fine Cal Cabs along side the PB and see if I can easily pick out the Bordeaux blind. I won’t look at the colors, either.

If the PB is glaringly obvious to me, I am going to question if there might be elements in Bordeaux that a lot of people do not have receptors for. That would explain the inexplicable to me as to why so many people prefer Cal Cab over Bordeaux.

Very different scenario I'd say. "Which one is the Pichon Baron" is different than a total double blind. Double blind is hard, because you question and doubt yourself. In the last couple decades PB has pursued a "mid-modern" style, so I could see it double blind

If you think you can always tell the Bordeaux blind, we can easily arrange a blind tasting sometime.

So '95 Pichon Baron is still a "hold"?

Matt
I hope so. I have two bottles of the 95 and one older one (a 1985?) and I wasn't expecting to crack the 95s for a few years yet. The reference to tightness and lack of complexity gave me some reassurance that now isn't a good time to open them... but any dissenting views out there?
regards
Ian

The last time I had this wine was in 2005 and my notes include "Perhaps a bit young".

I'm tempted to try it again soon, but I think I'll wait for our 15 year retrospective tasting of '95 Bordeaux next year.

Matt, the 95 horizontal during strike? I liked it then, but felt a bit of time would help. Probably wait a couple more years.

Very different scenario I'd say. "Which one is the Pichon Baron" is different than a total double blind. Double blind is hard, because you question and doubt yourself. In the last couple decades PB has pursued a "mid-modern" style, so I could see it double blind

If you think you can always tell the Bordeaux blind, we can easily arrange a blind tasting sometime.

Dale, thank you very much. Please arrange, I will be down in a heartbeat.

As I said, I could be completely wrong. But I would be very surprised. I'll bring the Pichon Baron. If I fail, I will tell the world!

Covert

[Jenise]

I’m not saying that I couldn’t mistake a Pichon Baron for a Cal Cab, but in my mind I don’t think it is possible. I have a ‘95 PB and by hook or crook I am going to have someone provide several glasses of fine Cal Cabs along side the PB and see if I can easily pick out the Bordeaux blind. I won’t look at the colors, either.

If the PB is glaringly obvious to me, I am going to question if there might be elements in Bordeaux that a lot of people do not have receptors for. That would explain the inexplicable to me as to why so many people prefer Cal Cab over Bordeaux.

Hey, you know I taste wines double blind all the time when the wines at table could be just about anything from anywhere. And though yes, most of time, even in riper years, Calcabs and Bordeaux usually stand out as what they are but I've watched people who have more experience than you and I get fooled. Receptors? Maybe. But as someone who pours a lot of wine for a lot of people, unlike you in your hermitage , I have to opine that I think the difference you speak of is not that Bordeaux is sending a signal some don't get, it's that it doesn't send the signals many tend to prefer. In general: sweetness, ripeness, lushness.

But I don't know what any of this has to do with Mark and his bottle, he obviously loves Bordeaux and understands it pretty well. Most likely this is just about how a particular wine showed on a particular day.

I’m not saying that I couldn’t mistake a Pichon Baron for a Cal Cab, but in my mind I don’t think it is possible. I have a ‘95 PB and by hook or crook I am going to have someone provide several glasses of fine Cal Cabs along side the PB and see if I can easily pick out the Bordeaux blind. I won’t look at the colors, either.

If the PB is glaringly obvious to me, I am going to question if there might be elements in Bordeaux that a lot of people do not have receptors for. That would explain the inexplicable to me as to why so many people prefer Cal Cab over Bordeaux.

Covert,
I normally have little problem distinguishing Bordeaux from CalCabs. To me, the savory elements that I discussed above (earth, mushrooms, herbal, tobacco) are the features that I look for in Bdx and indeed are the reasons that we buy them. However, I have been fooled before and I will no doubt be again. Aged bottles of Randy Dunn's Cabs have sometimes had a very Bordeaux-esque quality to them (usually Napa, not the nearly immortal Howell Mtn), as do Ridge's Monte Bello and some of the more modern/spoofy Bdx taste a whole lot more like Beringer Private Reserve than Ch. Latour. As you'll note from my post, my initial thought was toward Bdx, but the lack of savory elements and the straightforward nature of the fruit led me astray. My guess is that the wine is somewhat shut down right now, as I don't think that PB should lack those elements that define Bdx to me.

Mark Lipton

Dale-

Yes, that was the offline. Thank goodness I didn't have to walk home!

I found the '95s more open than I expected but not really ready to drink.

I have a case of '95 PB, I think cracking one next year is in order.

As the earth warms Bordeaux in the last few years tastes more like CA than it had previously.
Many make fun of the ripe wines coming out of CA but I know growers here that are very worried about global warming and the effects it has on their vineyards.

As the earth warms Bordeaux in the last few years tastes more like CA than it had previously.

I had always chalked this up mostly to style and technology changes, since some Bordeaux are changing more than others and some have changed little or not at all. Aside from 2003 of course.

As the earth warms Bordeaux in the last few years tastes more like CA than it had previously.

I had always chalked this up mostly to style and technology changes, since some Bordeaux are changing more than others and some have changed little or not at all. Aside from 2003 of course.

Most of the winemakers I know would disagree based on the fact that climate warming is here and everybody is being effected.

I've had some "issues" with some of the 1995 left bankers. Call me "stoopid" if you will but about ten years back (when I was far less experienced and uneducated in my selection processes), I bought several supposed reasonable labels from this vintage and, admittedly, probably started looking at them too early, but the general impression I got from trying half a dozen and more on many an occasion (Leoville Poyferre, Gloria, Sociando-Mallet, Pontet-Canet, Duhart-Milon-Rothschild to name a few off the top of my head) was this was a pretty tough, somewhat under-fruited vintage bordering on "austere". I'm sure there's plenty of examples where other Chateaux performed admirably but my experience put me off even considering purchasing more 1995ers for many years thereafter. Perhaps time will pay dividends but I regurlarly note many 1995's still performing up to initial lofty expectations (and in particular, their elevated prices of the day). I still have a few languishing in the cellar but I still tend to grimace every time I look at the box they live in and most often move onto more fertile/attractive sections of my cellar.

Does/has anyone have/had a similar experience?

David
I can't really give a view on '95 as a vintage, but would say that I really don't have a taste for immature Bordeaux. Thankfully I do tend to like it over-mature if not quite pushing up daisies. Thus I'm usually able to lean on the side of a little more sleep. It sounds like that may be a good strategy for your 95s. Maybe lean towards the end of suggested drinking windows.
regards
Ian

[David M. Bueker]

From my tastings of '95 Bordeaux (many and varied) the wines are evolving at a glacial pace & really don't show much at all. I only have a few bottles (but have a good friend with a large stash), and I don't see drinking many of them for at least another 10 years.

Most of the winemakers I know would disagree based on the fact that climate warming is here and everybody is being effected.

How far back are winemakers saying warming has affected them? While I don't doubt the effects of warming, I postulate that style changes and taste changes dwarf what warming has done in Bordeaux. Of course, I'm just a taster, not a wine maker.

I have a stack of 95 left bankers, including Pichon-Baron, and so far the only ones I have cracked have been the lesser bougeois like Phélan-Ségur, Verdignan and Hortevie; these have all been enjoyable. However, I have deferred trying any of the others, PB, Sociando-Mallet, Rauzan-Ségla, Poujeaux, Pontet-Canet, I think, because of frequent reports like this one and experience of tastings of manifestly unready wines with drying tannins.

The question is - will they ever be ready?

I have a stack of 95 left bankers, including Pichon-Baron, and so far the only ones I have cracked have been the lesser bougeois like Phélan-Ségur, Verdignan and Hortevie; these have all been enjoyable. However, I have deferred trying any of the others, PB, Sociando-Mallet, Rauzan-Ségla, Poujeaux, Pontet-Canet, I think, because of frequent reports like this one and experience of tastings of manifestly unready wines with drying tannins.

The question is - will they ever be ready?

I'm whistling to the same tune, Tim.

I am confident that our patience will be rewarded.

I normally have little problem distinguishing Bordeaux from CalCabs. To me, the savory elements that I discussed above (earth, mushrooms, herbal, tobacco) are the features that I look for in Bdx and indeed are the reasons that we buy them. However, I have been fooled before and I will no doubt be again. Aged bottles of Randy Dunn's Cabs have sometimes had a very Bordeaux-esque quality to them (usually Napa, not the nearly immortal Howell Mtn), as do Ridge's Monte Bello and some of the more modern/spoofy Bdx taste a whole lot more like Beringer Private Reserve than Ch. Latour. As you'll note from my post, my initial thought was toward Bdx, but the lack of savory elements and the straightforward nature of the fruit led me astray. My guess is that the wine is somewhat shut down right now, as I don't think that PB should lack those elements that define Bdx to me.

Mark, my experience-based logic says I could never mistake one for the other, but more reliable evidence-based logic tells me that I could easily mistake the two. I have wondered a lot about the whole Judgment at Paris conundrum and reasoned that all the judges could not be sans Bordeaux receptors.

I have also experienced Cal Cab functioning as a spoiler among Bordeaux, much as a heavy metal concert could drown out a piano sonata. And, I am hearing that some of the ‘95s are shut down, so that one could not perceive many of the typical Bordeaux elements.

I still need to find out for myself whether I can be fooled.

But I don't know what any of this has to do with Mark and his bottle, he obviously loves Bordeaux and understands it pretty well. Most likely this is just about how a particular wine showed on a particular day.

If the Emperor has no clothes, it is high time for me to face it. If I can't tell the difference, then I might as well just pour California plonk into my Bordeaux bottles as I empty them.

I hate to be the one to break the news but confusing wines on tasting is hardly extraordinary. I recall once Broadbent mistaking a Rhone for a Bordeaux. A young journalist at the tasting asked him, in shock, "Mr. Broadbent, how could you make such a mistake?". Broadbent smiled calmoly at the journalist and said "It doesn't happen often, young woman. Not more than once or twice a day"

On the other hand, and in defense of professionalism, I once saw Broadbent identify a blind-tasted wine and identify it by region, sub-region, vintage year, name of the chateau, then, after a pause, saying "between bottles numbered 3200-3700". He was right on. One day I will even reveal precisely how he did that with no "cheating" at all.

He who does not err is dead! Not an ideal place to be!!!

Best
Rogov