WTN: Tannic Dolcetto!

[David M. Bueker]

2015 Idlewild Dolcetto Fox Hill Vineyard - USA, California, North Coast, Mendocino County (5/24/2017)
Normally the Idlewild wines are so drinkable I don't know how to stop. In this case, some of the baby fat had melted away, and the wine was very tight/clenched. I gave it 24 hours to loosen up, and it showed a lot more fruit/depth, but it still had a lot of tannin. California Dolcetto with a lot of tannin? Go figure!

The wine has plenty of depth to wait for some softening, but beware the teeth for now. I am really looking forward to what happens with this wine in 2-3 more years.

Still have only tried one Idlewild.
Not really surprised by tannic Dolcetto. We've had the discussion before on this forum, people think "little sweet one" or "Italy's Beaujolais" and are surprised by tannins. I think Dolcetto is naturally high tannin low acid (as opposed to Barbera which is high acid low tannin) but obviously some producers bypass that with very short macerations.

[Robin Garr]

I think Dolcetto is naturally high tannin low acid (as opposed to Barbera which is high acid low tannin)

That's the conventional wisdom all right. I once mixed together some leftover Barbera and Dolcetto from the same producer and vintage, to see if they'd balance out. The result was actually kind of boring.

[David M. Bueker]

Thanks.

I was never a Dolcetto drinker until I got my hands on Idlewild, and started to get access to Cappellano!

I think Dolcetto is naturally high tannin low acid (as opposed to Barbera which is high acid low tannin)

That generalization is for the grapes (juice or must) itself not for a finished wine. Take a “finished” Barbera wine the acid concentration could be “searing”, “brisk and pleasant” or “flat” depending upon a how far MLF is allowed to take its course (depending upon the percentages of tartaric acid and malic acid of the Barbera juice or must). Bulk aging Barbera wine in oak cask adds tannin.

Salute

Don't know about California Dolcetto, but the Piemonte version can be quite tannic. Don't really understand the usual comparison with Beaujolais. Perhaps it is because I have mainly tried Dolcettos from the better producers...?

[Robin Garr]

Don't really understand the usual comparison with Beaujolais.

It goes back a long way, to the '80s at least, when the US was just beginning to wake up to fine wine, and I've always assumed it was based on a careless translation as "little sweet one."

Don't really understand the usual comparison with Beaujolais.

It goes back a long way, to the '80s at least, when the US was just beginning to wake up to fine wine, and I've always assumed it was based on a careless translation as "little sweet one."

Seems to have got into British consciousness too, but it could well have come via America. Anyway, it sounds like a plausible theory, and I'm glad that it was not only me that thought it strange.

[David M. Bueker]

Ah well, sorry for falling into a trap that clearly irritates people (why I have no idea). Given that I can count on one hand the different Dolcetto bottlings I have ever had, as well as the general lack of tannin in so many California wines, the level of tannin in the Idlewild was a surprise.

David - I'm not irritated, and hope you were not by anything I said.

I have little experience of California wine compared with you and many others here and would have few expectations about a California Dolcetto. I was just chipping into the discussion with some of my own experiences with those from Piemonte and wondering if that might be untypical.

[David M. Bueker]

Nah. It's all good.

I think Dolcetto is naturally high tannin low acid (as opposed to Barbera which is high acid low tannin)

That generalization is for the grapes (juice or must) itself not for a finished wine. Take a “finished” Barbera wine the acid concentration could be “searing”, “brisk and pleasant” or “flat” depending upon a how far MLF is allowed to take its course (depending upon the percentages of tartaric acid and malic acid of the Barbera juice or must). Bulk aging Barbera wine in oak cask adds tannin.

Salute

In my experience, red wines are almost always put through full MLF. Some Barberas are de-acidified, though.

Don't really understand the usual comparison with Beaujolais.

It goes back a long way, to the '80s at least, when the US was just beginning to wake up to fine wine, and I've always assumed it was based on a careless translation as "little sweet one."

That sounds right. Good Dolcetto is usually both fruity and tannic. Producers tell me the name comes from the sweetness of the fruit when ripe.

[Robin Garr]

Producers tell me the name comes from the sweetness of the fruit when ripe.

I've heard that, too. Sweet grape, not sweet wine. It doesn't come in at a particularly high alcohol level when fermented dry, though, which argues against an unusual amount of fruit sugar. Might be a flavor profile that accentuates the sweetness of the unfermented grape, though.

Don't know about California Dolcetto, but the Piemonte version can be quite tannic. Don't really understand the usual comparison with Beaujolais. Perhaps it is because I have mainly tried Dolcettos from the better producers...?

Yup....I find most of the PiemonteDolcettos on the hard/tannic side as well. What puzzles me is that they
don't seem to age particularly well.
The association of Dolcetto & Bojo is one that always puzzles me. I don't find the remotest resemblance betwixt the two.
Yet there are still basic wine books out there that label Dolcetto as the Italian Bojo.
I much prefer the Dolcettos from Dogliani. Oliver carries a few that are exceptional.
Tom

I love all things Italian, but I've yet to have a Dolcetto that I found compelling. But that may just be a small sample statistics issue. The notion of Cali Dolcetto I find very intriguing.

[David M. Bueker]

Ryan, if you ever come across a bottle of Cappellano Dolcetto you will have something compelling.

For a red wine that is going to be consumed within a year or two after bottling I don’t see any real problems with using MLF to obtain “desirable” results. In the case the red wine is going to be laid down and bottle aged for an extended period of time that’s a different story. After MLF you could see a 1 to 3g/L reduction in acidity and an increase of possible .3 units in pH.

As far as the translation “little sweet one”, it may not even be a reference to the grape but the area where it was grown. One producer of Dolcetto from Dogliani labels his wine “1593” in reference to the year an edict was filed with the municipality of Dogliani which forbidden the harvesting of “dozzetti” grapes before St Matthew’s Day.

Salute