Rhone Ringers?

I'll be attending a Northern Rhone tasting at the end of the week and the organizer has stated that 'ringers' are quite acceptable.

Just about no Aussie and few California or Washington syrahs would pass but I have a couple of ideas as to what might.

Any suggestions?

(And yes, I thought of decanting a real Hermitage into a Shiraz bottle but thought that was too tricky - and might not work.

with some age, ESJ Syrahs. I often get smoke and grilled meats on Durrells, and olives on Wylie-Fenaughtys. They are California wines, and show it, but think blind they might pass. But hard to source.
Maybe Fause Piste in Washington

Mullineux from SA.

Something from the Rocks area in WA? Reynvaan, for example? Lots of savory elements in this area. Santa Barbara syrahs can also be interesting and good quality, but we don't really get any in BC.

Both of you are thinking the same way I am.

The Mullineux isn't represented in BC, but I have another that is, and I have a small stash of some Santa Maria syrah from California, of a ripe old age. The Cape wine is early 2000s and the US wine is late 1990s.

Any bets on which would make the best bet as a ringer for an old Northern Rhone? I won't drop the names here as the host sometimes drops by, but if you want to help me choose I can PM them to you.

My reading is that the Cape wines start out for the most part more Rhonelike, but the CA Syrahs shed the attributes that would be a giveaway, with age, so might also pass.

I quickly wrote off any chance of having an Aussie Shiraz present the way I'd need it to, to be a believable ringer. Many of them would be like trying to take a Zinfandel to an old Burgundy tasting.......

I don't know many Santa Maria syrahs so poor for advice.
Qupe might be another one- I think pretty Californian, but not OTT.
I wouldn't totally give up on Shiraz. Some of the older (like 1998 and earlier) Penfolds (not Grange) were 13 or 13.5 abv, and didn't scream sweet new World.

Dale, the use of American oak in Aussie wines of the period was ubiquitous and there is not wishing that an otherwise presentable syrah didn't have the heavy hit of dill.

The 1991 Wynns John Riddoch cab I opened awhile ago was lovely but sure wouldn't pass as anything but dill-ridden, and I can't think of one that would. All it takes is a whiff and you pretty much nail that sort of wine as Spanish, US, or Australian, before you even taste it.

I have Aussie wines back to the mid 1980s and can't think of a single one that could pass as a Rhone. It is possible that some of the more modern Aussie wines could be candidates, but I stopped buying them in the early 2000s - just not a style I liked any more.

Why I said no Grange, but some of the other Penfolds such as 128 are all French.

Bonny Doon Le Pousseur.

-Paul W.

Why I said no Grange, but some of the other Penfolds such as 128 are all French.

That's a good nomination, Dale - not only French Oak but cool climate. The RWT, for instance, although also French oak, wouldn't have a hope of passing, nor the Kalimna, which is also warm climate plus all American oak..

Bonny Doon Le Sophiste.

-Paul W.

If I were going to open a white ringer, it would probably be a Vieilles Vignes Roussanne from Beaucastel,.

I haven't tasted the Sophiste in years (do they still make it?) but it certainly would fit. The only other wannabe Rhone of his I've tasted recently was the Cigar Volante and I recall thinking that if Grahm truly thought that wine was anything like a Chateauneuf he'd been smoking too much Jolly Green.

Bill, the 2015 Keller Estate Rotie from the Sonoma Coast reminded me a lot of a Northern Rhone. It is co-fermented with some Viognier. Definitely you can pick up the Viognier.

Not available up here, Jim, but it does look pretty inviting. Must ask Jenise if she gets it there (no use for this Friday's tasting of course, but it might be nice to have a bottle or two for future ringer use).

Does Swiss Syrah from Valais make it to BC? Some are very good and very N. Rhône like. However in a very literal sense it is N.Rhône, but from even further upstream and from another country.

Also some Mondeuse from Savoie can be quite like N.Rhône in an even more peppery way.

I know Jenise can get the Rotie Cellars wines. Their Northern Blend is also Syrah co-fermented with a small amount of Viognier. Often too ripe for a ringer, but if you found a cooler vintage one (my knowledge of WA vintages is limited, so unsure what that would be- maybe Jenise could chime in)/

Great suggestions.
The tasting has been rescheduled for the end of the month, so I should be able to round up some of these and perhaps taste them.

I think it is more plausible to find a syrah from the US that might pass, but it would have to be a cool climate wine!

with some age, ESJ Syrahs.

That's where my thoughts went, Dale. I had a 2011 Wylie-Fenaughty served blind to me two years ago and I swore I was drinking Cote Rotie.

just for the sake of accuracy, the last Wylie-Fenaughty we made was in '10; in 2011 we made a Fenaughty Syrah (we stopped working with the Wylie vineyard, because of issues with the new owner.)

Bonny Doon Le Sophiste..

Oops--I meant Bonny Doon Le Pousseur. The syrah, not the roussanne. I corrected this in my previous post and also in the tasting note I posted in the Wine Focus thread.

-Paul W.

[Jenise]

Not available up here, Jim, but it does look pretty inviting. Must ask Jenise if she gets it there (no use for this Friday's tasting of course, but it might be nice to have a bottle or two for future ringer use).

Have not seen the Keller in my area.

[David M. Bueker]

The 2012 Wind Gap Majik Vineyard Syrah I had the other day would be perfect, but just not viable due to availability.

[Jenise]

I know Jenise can get the Rotie Cellars wines. Their Northern Blend is also Syrah co-fermented with a small amount of Viognier. Often too ripe for a ringer, but if you found a cooler vintage one (my knowledge of WA vintages is limited, so unsure what that would be- maybe Jenise could chime in)/

I like Rotie wines, and they are available locally but they don't age well and the switch that's off that makes them not candidates for aging is probably too big a giveaway for a suitable ringer.

I agree re Rocks district syrahs from Washington. They get closer to the Northern Rhone model than any I've had from California (or anywhere else). Reynvaan is the obvious name that comes to mind, but my top picks for less well-known but excellent and more affordable options would be II Vintners and Kevin White.

In answer to Dale's question, the last cool vintage we had was 2011. 2014 was not a cool vintage per se, but it was a cool-ish and difficult vintage that produced some wines I especially liked for not being a rank-and-file 'good vintage' of the type modern critics prefer. '12 and '15 were especially hot and many wines lacked structure. '13, '16 and '17 are very similar and all had both good fruit and structure. '18 apparently is coming in likewise.

Speaking of cool, something that's happening now in WA is that growers are planting on north-facing slopes to create a cool-climate effect. I don't know of any wines available yet that would have that feature, but it's in the works.

Speaking of cool, something that's happening now in WA is that growers are planting on north-facing slopes to create a cool-climate effect. I don't know of any wines available yet that would have that feature, but it's in the works.

Interesting! I bet that with global warming that approach will catch on!

[Jenise]

Makes perfect sense, doesn't it? At the very least, one would get grapes that would/could temper the ripeness from the sunny slopes to create more elegant, European style wines.