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WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx +)

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Dale Williams

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WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx +)

by Dale Williams » Tue Apr 15, 2025 12:11 pm

So we had talked about tastings of Alto Piedmont and Lombardian Nebbiolos, and of Piedmont Grapes other than Nebbiolo. We decided to combine and a nice group (one person didn’t know was coming!) gathered at my house for a night of:
Langhe, but Not Nebbiolo
and
Nebbiolo, but Not Langhe.


Gravlax, assorted charcuterie, smoked mussels and bay scallops, cheeses (Robiola, a truffle toma, Ossau Iraty, Camembert and a Val d’Aoste Fontina), chips, etc.

2007 Corbon Blanc de BlancsGrand Cru Champagne
Apple, pear, lemon pie, fresh and chalky. A-

2019 Ch Feuillet Petite Arvine (Val d'Aosta)
Candied lemon drops, melon, honey, fun flavors but I found the texture a bit heavy and thought it just a touch hot. B-

2019 G. Rinaldi Freisa
Dark berries, anise-y herbs, perfumed. Group differed on preference for 16/19,I think I was in minority. B+

2016 G. Rinaldi Freisa
Heavier and just a hint of syrup, black plum and red strawberry fruit with a little smoked meat note.B

I didn’t find either Freisa “Totally repugnant” (Supposed Parker quote)

2012 Burlotto Dolcetto d’Alba
Low acid, a bit hot, with an ashtray note on finish. B-/C+

Sasha’s Blind Wine
Tangy., floral, cherries and a little tarry note. Pretty sure no one was in Oregon!
2017 Cameron Nebbiolo. B

Jay’s Blind Wine (not blind to me, not quite on theme but I ruled permissable)
Purple color, a bit lifted, red fruit and sandalwood, don’t love the flavor profile but nice light texture and good finish. Someone got CA and Barbera eventually. B-
2023 Extradimensional Shake Ridge Barbera

2016 Burlotto Barbera d’Alba
Good acids but a little alcoholic heat, herby finish. B-

2016 Oddero Barbera d'Asti Nizza
Tasty, young, raspberries and pomegranate molasses, good finish, good brightness, B/B+

2001 G. Mascarello Barbera d’Alba Codana
I found the nose unpleasant, both lactic and oxidized, and the palate not very attractive as well. Someone kept pressing me to try again (and again), it did get better, but not to point I wanted to drink it. Unsure if bottle or wine. C+

1997 Pelissero Freisa
This is apparently in the vivace (spritzy) style like Bartolo M used to make, but any effervescence was gone (it was decanted for sediment), but I enjoyed what was left. An interesting/singular profile of sour cherry/raspberry with a perfumed/floral note. Some really disliked, they were wrong! B++

2018 Marguet “La Grande Ruelle” Champagne
I think I understood that this is Blanc de Noirs. Apple pie, peanut skin, chalk, good finish. I enjoy this a lot, but less so on a revisit later in evening, it seems to be advancing rapidly (while the Corbon is still singing). But at its best B+/A-

1971 Barbacarolo (Lino Maga) (cork fell in, so served from a Chilean SB bottle)
Not quite on theme, as Lombardia but not Nebbiolo. But we’ll take it! Sour orange, red cherries, forest floor/mushrooms. Touch of brown sugar on finish. Interesting. B+/B

OK, on to the Nebbiolo. I served dinner about here - manzo/brasato in red wine, risotto with mushrooms, broccoli rabe, and morcilla for the intrepid.

(both Lombardi Nebbiolos were mine, both especially the Inferno seemed DOA at decanting, the miracle of older Nebbiolo)
1990 Rainoldi Valtellina Superiore Inferno
I found this bright and delicious, with cherry fruit overlaid with citrus zest, leather, and balsamic notes. Does tire a bit at end, but at peak B+

1985 Rainoldi Sassella
Quieter, faded fruit, leather and rose petals. A light caramel note. I liked, in an elegant old dowager way, thought it actually reminded me of old Sangiovese more than Nebbiolo. Some thought it improved in glass. B

1971 M. Mascarello Nebbiolo d’Alba (also technically a bit off theme)
Still some good fruit, lovely nose with incense and tar, tangy mineral finish. A-/B+

1967 Antoniolo Spanna Santachiara
Dried cherries, rose petals, tar. Nice to start and pIcks up steam . Complete and complex, elegant. A-

1964 Antoniolo Spanna Santachiara
Saddle leather and cherries, a little pine needle on nose, nice length. B

1964 Fiore Spanna
One person found this corked, but no one else. I liked- red plums and desiccated cherries, mushrooms, quite mature but not tired. B

1964 Fratelli Beccaro Ghemme
This is both mature and a bit tired, but there’s a nice soulful pensioner here. Little fruit left, more forest floor and mushrooms, but I still found interesting. B

1961 Nervi Riserva del Titolare Gattinara,
Comes across a bit thin at first but really picks up weight. Sour cherry, orange zest, white flowers. Long finish and is at its best at end of night while cleaning up. A-/B+

That’s it for the Italians! While I prepared a couple of blind wines, Rahsaan poured the
2017 Rebholz Ganz Horn Riesling Grosses Gewachs. Powerful but balanced, white nectarine and grapefruit, flint/smoke. Quite long, and my end of table is discussing how we need to buy Rebholz! A-

There was also a 2002 J.J. Christoffel Erdener Treppchen Riesling Auslese ** as one designated driver only drinks low alcohol wines, but when I saw it at end of night it was too warm to try.

So I served 2 off theme blinds to finish off:
Blind # 1- Immediate Bordeaux, followed by St Julien (I said good guess if wrong). First guesses for vintage were 1989 and 1990, then 1978, then I think John got 1970. Once someone guessed Haut Medoc, John and Sasha guessed La Lagune at same time, A very nice showing. Still some structure, but the soft ripeness/plushness of the vintage is there as well. Cassis, red cherry, cigarbox, mushrooms, and just a hint of bell pepper. Nicely balanced, classic. 1970 La Lagune A-

Blind #2 - this took longer, everyone was on Left Bank for a while. Once they got to Pomerol, I said you’re not going to think of this estate, which led to some fun guessing of obscure properties before I ended the pain. Red cherries, citrus zest, Earl Grey tea, fallen leaves. Solid and tasty, if not exciting. Good showing for an almost 60 year old 4th tier Pomerol. 1966 Beauregard. B+/B

Jay had brought cookies that were well received. Funnight- interesting wines, nice people (who were friendly to the poorly behaved hound). Especially Jay
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Grade disclaimer: I'm a very easy grader, basically A is an excellent wine, B a good wine, C drinkable. Anything below C means I wouldn't drink at a party where it was only choice. Furthermore, I offer no promises of objectivity, accuracy, and certainly not of consistency.
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Rahsaan

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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Rahsaan » Tue Apr 15, 2025 1:29 pm

Dale Williams wrote:2019 Ch Feuillet Petite Arvine (Val d'Aosta)
Candied lemon drops, melon, honey, fun flavors but I found the texture a bit heavy and thought it just a touch hot. B-


Yes, this was interesting. Tasty, but presented as a mountain wine, which didn't really make sense for me, given all that heavy texture. Seemed like another case of warm weather getting ahead of things. But surely could have a place accompanying a nice meal.

Dale Williams wrote:2019 G. Rinaldi Freisa
Dark berries, anise-y herbs, perfumed. Group differed on preference for 16/19,I think I was in minority. B+

2016 G. Rinaldi Freisa
Heavier and just a hint of syrup, black plum and red strawberry fruit with a little smoked meat note.B


So you heard a room consensus for the 16? I didn't notice either way. I liked both, with maybe a slight edge to the 16 for drinking now, because I found the 19 more structured. Not sure how that connects with your read on the 16 being heavier. But I don't have much context for Freisa, although these two did leave me more favorably inclined than prior to drinking them.


Dale Williams wrote:1967 Antoniolo Spanna Santachiara
Dried cherries, rose petals, tar. Nice to start and pIcks up steam . Complete and complex, elegant. A-

1964 Antoniolo Spanna Santachiara
Saddle leather and cherries, a little pine needle on nose, nice length. B


Interesting. Do you think that was the general consensus on the two vintages? I know Sasha gushed this AM over the '67 remnants, but technically wasn't comparing with the '64 remnants.

I liked both and of course one need not choose. But for my palate, while the '67 was in a lovely state of evolved harmony, I did appreciate the extra richness and vigor in the '64. I suppose you saw CSW did an offer today with both of these wines, have been tempted, but also suffer from ongoing offer fatigue...

Dale Williams wrote:While I prepared a couple of blind wines, Rahsaan poured the
2017 Rebholz Ganz Horn Riesling Grosses Gewachs. Powerful but balanced, white nectarine and grapefruit, flint/smoke. Quite long, and my end of table is discussing how we need to buy Rebholz! A-

There was also a 2002 J.J. Christoffel Erdener Treppchen Riesling Auslese ** as one designated driver only drinks low alcohol wines, but when I saw it at end of night it was too warm to try.


Glad the Rebholz went over well with your side! I remain a big fan and the Ganz Horn is so great for drinking (whereas Kastanienbusch is more 'impressive' but not always as easy to enjoy). The regular "Im Sonnenschein" GG is another good one for drinking, but the Ganz Horn subplot is often more complex.

I kept holding off on the Christoffel because of not wanting to mix my palate with the sweeter wine, and then forgot to taste at the end as we dashed out the door. But just seeing the bottle brought back so many memories of Premier Cru and the 02 vintage.

Thanks again for fantastic hosting, made it all seem so smooth!
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David M. Bueker

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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by David M. Bueker » Tue Apr 15, 2025 1:45 pm

Re the YEAH! Barbera…I am not terribly wild about Barbera in California. Sam Bilbro has used it successfully in his blended Red Wine, but beyond that it seems that most California sites just exacerbate Barbera’s bad tendencies.
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Dale Williams

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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Dale Williams » Tue Apr 15, 2025 2:45 pm

Rahsaan,
I did think more people (Sasha, Kim at my end) seemed to prefer '16 Freisa. But didn't poll table.
I preferred the 67, but didn't get a consensus re the Antoniolos, I was too busy trying to move flights along to poll room :)
I need to explore Rebholz more.
It may have seemed smooth, but when Jeff walked in door it didn't feel smooth (I had included on initial email March 15, and follow ups, but after he didn't respond by April 1st I had dropped off my list). It worked out fine , happy to have him (and he brought nice wines), but was a shock.

David,
I thought the YEAH Barbera was well made, but don't think all grapes need to be grown in CA!
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by David M. Bueker » Tue Apr 15, 2025 3:11 pm

Agree that it’s a well made wine, but so is the Idlewild varietal Barbera, and the Bedrock Barbera. None of them are particularly interesting.

So far Barbera seems best as an accent grape in California.
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Rahsaan » Tue Apr 15, 2025 4:39 pm

Dale Williams wrote:It may have seemed smooth, but when Jeff walked in door it didn't feel smooth (I had included on initial email March 15, and follow ups, but after he didn't respond by April 1st I had dropped off my list). It worked out fine , happy to have him (and he brought nice wines), but was a shock.


Yes, that was funny!
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Mark Lipton » Wed Apr 16, 2025 1:22 pm

Disappointed to see no Pelaverga at this event, though there was certainly no shortage of excellent and interesting wines. I'm especially fond of Burlotto's and Castello di Verduno's versions.
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Dale Williams

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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Dale Williams » Wed Apr 16, 2025 2:01 pm

The person bringing the Burlotto Pelaverga got sick and cancelled Fri, I think Sasha was also going to bring and switched off as no flightmate.
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Mark Lipton » Wed Apr 16, 2025 3:23 pm

Dale Williams wrote:The person bringing the Burlotto Pelaverga got sick and cancelled Fri, I think Sasha was also going to bring and switched off as no flightmate.


'Tis a shame. I'll take Pelaverga over Barbera 9 times out of 10.
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Dale Williams » Wed Apr 16, 2025 3:45 pm

agree, and I wouldn't have minded a bit of Grignolino as well!
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Dale Williams » Thu Apr 17, 2025 1:56 pm

I didn't have wine Monday or Tuesday but last night retried a few leftovers ('61 Nervi, both Rinaldis, and Rebhloz were still going strong; I really disliked the Petite Arvine though it wasn't oxidized) and tried the 2002 J.J. Christoffel Erdener Treppchen Riesling Auslese ** that I had skipped Sunday. Good showing, no overt oxidation, very sweet peach fruit with ginger and honeysuckle, good acids, tangy finish.
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Rahsaan » Thu Apr 17, 2025 3:28 pm

Impressive. Bodes well for the Christoffel if you still have more!
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Re: WTN: Langhe but not Nebbiolo, Nebb. but not Langhe(+Bdx

by Jeff Grossman » Fri Apr 18, 2025 12:58 pm

Sounds like a great event. ::jealous::

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